Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

General messages about RTC and it's development.

Moderator: George Gilbert

Forum rules
Please read the Forum rules and policies before posting.
User avatar
Adamo
Italodance spammer
Posts: 1534
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:59 am
Location: Poland
Contact:

Post by Adamo »

welll... both are very good, but CSBwin seems to be much faster... I don`t know if I`m right (?), but I heard that in RTC all levels are "moving", wchich is a huge limitation and that slows the game, when you have big dungeon (correct me, if I`m wrong!).

RTC has definitely better editor.

Zyx said:
Graphics:
*RTC allow any kind of graphic, full color, high resolution. Easy to link.
->it's a trap! melanging graphics of several qualities should be avoided, imho, so this feature is wether useless or requires too much work.

*CSBuild only allows 16 colors low resolution pictures.
I agree with that !
Spoiler
(\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/) (\__/)
Spoiler
(@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@) (@.@)
Spoiler
(>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<) (>s<)
User avatar
beowuuf
Archmastiff
Posts: 20687
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 2:00 pm
Location: Basingstoke, UK

Post by beowuuf »

Have you noticed significant game slowing in RTC? In CSBwin, all levels move after you have visited them too, just at 1/5 of the speed, or somehting
User avatar
Suule
On Master
Posts: 656
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:42 pm
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Post by Suule »

Yes. at 1/5 with monsters' AI partially switched off.
User avatar
Sophia
Concise and Honest
Posts: 4239
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 9:50 pm
Location: Nowhere in particular
Contact:

Post by Sophia »

In theory, probably, but right now there are a lot of bugs in the RTC editor, so one has to be pretty careful with it. :(
Adamo wrote:RTC has definitely better editor.
Da_Ruby
Novice
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:43 am

Post by Da_Ruby »

I'm a newb on these forums but have played DM ever since I had it on my snes (i got it out and completed it again the other day)

CSBwin i havent tried so cannot possibly comment on it though i will give it a go at a later date.

RTC... I love. I love it because it is different. I love it because although limited in some ways you can do so many things and have so much fun doing it.

Im creating my first small dungeon just to test if trap triggers are working then im gonna move on (but thats for another thread)

Im gonna report bugs as i find them (or things that maybe cant be done yet)..

Yeah it may be closed source but the thing is, this one person is spending all his time building the game he loved from scratch with pretty much a brand new script and constantly editing... You can make your own script open source but, isnt enough that the game is freeware??? (and it saves have numerous different versions of the same program on the market all doing different things ;) )

I love the game and to be fair will give CSBwin a shot and see how i feel.
User avatar
beowuuf
Archmastiff
Posts: 20687
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 2:00 pm
Location: Basingstoke, UK

Post by beowuuf »

And if you see the amlount of 'done for v0.35' messages you know it's not so limited anymore : )
Da_Ruby
Novice
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:43 am

Post by Da_Ruby »

sweet, i'll go take a looksie :) and i'll send george that file tonight. Thanks for the PM
User avatar
George Gilbert
Dungeon Master
Posts: 3022
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2000 11:04 am
Location: London, England
Contact:

Post by George Gilbert »

RTC V0.35 is now released and hopefully addresses all of the "deficiencies" highlighted in this thread, and adds several new features (noteably support for PNG / alpha channels / MP3) - have fun!

As ever, your feedback is much appreciated - if you have any further comments, just let me know and I'll do my best to implement any changes for future versions.
Duckman
Adept
Posts: 235
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 11:39 am
Location: Finland

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Duckman »

I think the main reason is that CSBwin has been longer around than RTC. Well, it's originality might be a reason too, but not alone, as else DSB would be much better known than it is now.
I don't post anymore for reasons real-life.
User avatar
ian_scho
High Lord
Posts: 2806
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:30 am
Location: Zaragoza, Spain

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by ian_scho »

This thread was started in 2005.... I don't think that it's true to say that CSBwin IS more popular than RTC now! We're on v0.49 for RTC, not v0.35 mentioned 2 posts earlier.
Having said that, I really wonder if CSBwin, or at least it's source code, will spawn more clones on more new types of hardware!
User avatar
beowuuf
Archmastiff
Posts: 20687
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 2:00 pm
Location: Basingstoke, UK

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by beowuuf »

CSBwin and RTC were around at the same time. DMJ was the early engine.
Was unable to (permenantly) kill off ian_scho (Haynuus), Ameena, oh_brother (Westian), money (Falkor), raixel (Petal) and Lord_Bones (Aurek) in the DM D&D game Time's Champions!

CONGRATULATIONS TO THOSE WHO MADE THE GAME WHAT IT WAS - GREAT!
User avatar
ian_scho
High Lord
Posts: 2806
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:30 am
Location: Zaragoza, Spain

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by ian_scho »

When did RTC get it's editor, for example. I recall Sophia telling me she had to work in the plain text file for one of her early dungeons. Oh the pure fun of it! The creative juices really flow when I see this:

00001000
00001000
00011100
00010100
00011100
00000000

I assumed that RTC had morphed more than CSBwin which each version, from it's early incarnations.
User avatar
Jan
Mighty Pirate
Posts: 2760
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:55 pm
Location: Scumm Bar, Czech Republic

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Jan »

Heh, I also think that the title of this thread is a bit obsolete. :)

But I've always been more into CSBWin.

However, just to make sure, because I don't know RTC very well, a stupid question - does RTC support a Playback option? :?:
Finally playing and immensely enjoying the awesome Thimbleweed Park-a-reno!
User avatar
Trantor
Duke of Banville
Posts: 2466
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 4:16 am
Location: Berlin, Germany
Contact:

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Trantor »

Over the past years, RTC has become closer and closer to the original games (and thus, CSBWin). When I came to this forum in early 2005, I didn't like RTC; sleeping took forever, monsters attacked you immediately they came on the adjacent tile to yours etc. Even though there still are differences (projectiles fly faster, monster can split up and regroup, spellcasting monsters and DES VEN are way overpowered), they became smaller and smaller.
Looking at the custom dungeons that got released, I'd say RTC is definitely more popular for designers. The reasons are more or less obvious: you have less limitations in size, number of monsters per level etc., it is easier to implement your own graphics and sounds, and getting into some advanced stuff is easier in RTC (though you can probably do more with DSAs once you get into them). These are exactly the reasons why I switched my dungeon from CSBWin to RTC.

As for playing, I still prefer CSB. The real gem, however, is probably DSB. It plays faithfully to the original games and has monster movement sounds. Plus, it is certainly the most powerful engine when it comes to building your own stuff. We only need a really awesome dungeon to prove it (something like, oh I don't know, Dark Portal 2 maybe :wink:).
User avatar
Gambit37
Should eat more pies
Posts: 13714
Joined: Wed May 31, 2000 1:57 pm
Location: Location, Location
Contact:

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Gambit37 »

ian_scho wrote:When did RTC get it's editor, for example.
You can check the development history for what's been added to RTC, and when. The editor first came with v0.26, 8 December 2003!!
Jan wrote:does RTC support a Playback option? :?:
Yes, since v0.42, 10 August 2006
Trantor wrote:[DSB] is certainly the most powerful engine when it comes to building your own stuff. We only need a really awesome dungeon to prove it
And a GUI editor ;-)
User avatar
ian_scho
High Lord
Posts: 2806
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:30 am
Location: Zaragoza, Spain

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by ian_scho »

The LUA editor is more important ;) ;)
User avatar
Jan
Mighty Pirate
Posts: 2760
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:55 pm
Location: Scumm Bar, Czech Republic

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Jan »

Gambit37 wrote:
Jan wrote:does RTC support a Playback option? :?:
Yes, since v0.42, 10 August 2006
OK. Cool. Erm. Could anybody tell me how it works? It's probably very easy... How do I make a video and replay it? Thanks. :?:
Finally playing and immensely enjoying the awesome Thimbleweed Park-a-reno!
User avatar
Gambit37
Should eat more pies
Posts: 13714
Joined: Wed May 31, 2000 1:57 pm
Location: Location, Location
Contact:

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Gambit37 »

From the config.txt file:

Code: Select all

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
; Recording playback                                                                ;
;                                                                                   ;
; PLAYBACK - filename                                                               ;
;                                                                                   ;
; N.B. Recordings of games are made by pressing CTRL+R during a game.  You can then ;
; play these back to view your game (or games played by other people) by enabling   ;
; the PLAYBACK option in this file (make sure the ';' is removed from the start of  ;
; the line) and specifying the name of file to view.                                ;
;                                                                                   ;
; During playback, press ESCAPE to pause or 'Q' to quit.  At the end of playback    ;
; normal gameplay resumes.                                                          ;
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

;PLAYBACK	RTCRecording_0000.rec
I've never tried it, could be a cool feature! :-)
User avatar
Chaos-Shaman
High Lord
Posts: 2642
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 7:26 pm
Location: The Gates of Hell

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

RTC has come a long way since then, it is nice to read some of the great comments as this engine developed. GG should not be surprised that his engine was capable of an AI that i can't seem to find anything to compare it to. With the addition of NPC that can be hired or dismissed back into the game at any point of contact has really brought this engine to life. When DSB comes out, i hope it has that ability to continue keeping alive DM with new features and ideas. unfortunately it is for programmers :( and not regular Jills like me.
keep your gor coin handy
User avatar
Ameena
Wordweaver, Murafu Maker
Posts: 7515
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2003 6:25 pm
Location: Here, where I am sitting!
Contact:

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Ameena »

Meh, I'm not a programmer and I found plenty of things in the RTC editor complicated. I bet the DSB engine is usable if you spend a while gtting to know it. I've never even downloaded DSB so I don't have any idea what the interface looks like or anything. Plus it's still being developed and stuff, isn't it? If people find the current editing system too difficult, maybe a simpler one (or at least, a simple-looking interface) will be added in later. I don't even know whether DSB uses a graphical interface like RTC does...but before RTC had its graphical interface, everyone had to create their dungeons by typing everything into a text file. And that worked out okay.
______________________________________________
Ameena, self-declared Wordweaver, Beastmaker, Thoughtbringer, and great smegger of dungeon editing!
User avatar
Chaos-Shaman
High Lord
Posts: 2642
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 7:26 pm
Location: The Gates of Hell

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

i have had a look and fiddled with DSB, limited for now, i see great potential for it in the future. since it took 8 years for RTC, i would estimate the same for DSB. i commend them both on their efforts
keep your gor coin handy
User avatar
Gambit37
Should eat more pies
Posts: 13714
Joined: Wed May 31, 2000 1:57 pm
Location: Location, Location
Contact:

Re: Why do people seem to prefer CSBWin to RTC?

Post by Gambit37 »

This thread is about CCSBWin and RTC, not DSB. Thread locked for going off topic.
Locked