Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Discuss Chaos Strikes Back, the "expansion pack" for Dungeon Master.
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Jan
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

lord soth 75 wrote:So now its back up into the DDD to find the remaining 2 ways
MAJOR SPOILERS FOLLOW. If you don't want me to spoil your adventure, search through the DDD area (I mean something like 10 or 20 squares behind the entrance) to find places where you haven't been so far. If they're inaccessible, try to open them up (consult the Hint Oracle).

Now. If you enter the DDD the Hint Oracle tells you ("Other Ways"):
Spoiler
"Wizard, bear right. Priest and Ninja, move hard right and up."
So -
Spoiler
both ROS and DAIN share their starts with NETA
but sooner or later they are diverted:

Where to look for these diversions:

ROS:
Spoiler
the room where you teleported a skeleton behind a portcullis + the area upstairs before you come there
.

DAIN:
Spoiler
closely behind the entrance to the DDD, behind a pit closed by a monster: instead of moving "hard right and up" continue forward.
I hope someone else would be able to answer your more technical / custom dungeons related questions.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

@ Jan
The Hint oracles 'hints' never seem relevant to whatever part i find myself having problems with.
Most of the time,its just giving me Monster descriptions and stuff. (Example provided below)

Searching for new paths in the DDD.

Adventure Log#21
Diabolical Demon Director
I went back to the DDD and back into the Pre-Neta path again,and i cant seem to find anything that is any different.Down the stairs leads back to the room with the blue mist and skeletons (which i already completed)
The pit in the DDD is still open (I suspect..that i have to close this pit in order to locate Ros or Dain)
I stood in front of a wall and killed my party with a couple of fireballs,then checked the Hint Oracle,and it was just waffling on about creatures.

Two pits seem to be the bug bear for me.
1-The invisible pit just past the stairs after 'Fighters charge' (In that corridor with a closed portcullis at end)
2-And this pit in the DDD,at the top of the stairs prior to the skeletons and blue mist.

There is nothing that is obvious that i need to do in the skeleton and blue mist area...I already did this room when i was on the path for the Neta Corbum.Unless i missed a switch in Neta that switches off the 2 pits that are hindering my progress.
Or..it may be i haven't found a switch in the room with many fire elementals at the beginning of the DDD...OR...Up the stairs from there,in the room with the Golem and the pits.

This game is a mind fu*k. :? :?
Romero and Carmack NEED to re-group.Modern gaming needs to be saved from the greedy bastards who are ruining it all.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by beowuuf »

Yeah, ROS and NETA use the skepeton area in two different ways, ROS - being the thief path - relies on a tiny switch earlier. Evil!
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

You're on a very good track with those two pits - you really are supposed to close them.
lord soth 75 wrote:1-The invisible pit just past the stairs after 'Fighters charge' (In that corridor with a closed portcullis at end)
I'll just Copy-Paste the Hint from the Oracle on that ("To Door"). Reveal the spoilers one by one - perhaps you'll come to the solution after the first or second line yourself:
Spoiler
There is weight on a pressure plate somewhere nearby that is keeping the pit open.
Spoiler
There is a Demon behind the fireballs exploding nearby.
Spoiler
Throw poison clouds at the grate door, these will kill the Demon and close the pit.
lord soth 75 wrote:2-And this pit in the DDD,at the top of the stairs prior to the skeletons and blue mist.
Two things here can draw your attention:

1. Look around the pit very carefully. You might find something very well hidden. As BW said, there's
Spoiler
a tiny switch in a crack in one of the walls.
And, more importantly:
2. Go back to the small room where the teleported skeleton was killed. Look around again. Perhaps the lock for the Tourquoise Key is not the only thing with which you can interact. Remember DM - you've met a similar puzzle there twice.
Spoiler
:shock:
:wink:

EDIT: Perhaps the Hint Oracle in RTC doesn't work properly, i.e. the hints are not displayed in proper places / when needed? I don't know. If yes, then it would be a very serious drawback.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

DDD-ROS

Adventure Log#22

Diabolical Demon Director
*Cheers to Jan (once again) for the hints yesterday.

Found the sneakily hidden switch in that wall to close the pit :)
The Demons had re-spawned again,and i had to take 2 of them out (Was also a Hell hound wandering around this area too)
4 brick switches closed a blue haze..and found the door to ROS.
DDD-ROS
The next section similar to the Zoom part of DM,only it included Demons lobbing fireballs at my party.
Took many attempts to find 'where' i was supposed to be going/doing here.(I noticed there was some hidden items..but i dont know how to get them)
This section was a complete pain in the ass because it wasn't fair on any level whatsoever.2 Fireballs from those annoying things was practically enough to incapacitate my entire party.

Killed another demon that was guarding a portcullis,and moved onward into what i initially thought was the Corbum area,but there is many pits here.and i haven't been able to locate the corbum piece yet.Lots of pits everywhere,and it seems like its a maze (of pits) puzzle that i have to solve.
I checked my Hint Oracle..But the hints it was providing were only relevant to the puzzle in the skeleton/blue haze puzzle back in the DDD.
The advice never addresses my immediate problems.
The rope will probably of some use in this section i suspect,but once again..WHY cant i climb up the rope too? Why only climb down..and technically you arent climbing down because you still hear the scream as the party falls through another pit directly beneath. So frustrating.
Romero and Carmack NEED to re-group.Modern gaming needs to be saved from the greedy bastards who are ruining it all.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Paul Stevens »

Down a Pit....Up a Stairs....Repeat until Done.

But it better be the right pit!
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Excellent progress! :P The "zoom" area is pretty tricky. There are several fancy items spread through it, but none of them is essential. There are also several very nasty traps, some of them leading to totally evil areas like the infamous
Spoiler
"Death Row"
.

About the "Pit Maze" you're now in: First what does the Hint Oracle say ("Look before you leap"):
Spoiler
When below, find the pit openings in the ceiling that are above the floor and not another pit.
Spoiler
Look where it is, relative to other ceiling pits and the stairs.
Spoiler
Go upstairs and drop an object in. Go downstairs and check for the object, then go back up and climb in.
The Corbum pillar is somewhere ahead. To get to it you must be able to navigate yourself through a maze of pits
Spoiler
spread through two levels
. IMHO, mapping is absolutely essential here.
Spoiler
Make two maps (one for each level) and overlay them (use the stairs to "rectify" them, i.e. find their relative position)
. Then follow Paul's advice. I can't imagine completing this 3D puzzle without a proper map. Even after all these years I have to use my maps because I just can't remember the right solution.

Forget about the rope, it's useless. You have enough HP to survive a fall and if you're injured, heal yourself. The rope just slows you down.
lord soth 75 wrote:WHY cant i climb up the rope too
In some of the custom dungeons you can find and use a "(war) grapple" that enables you to climb both up and down.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Ameena »

Ahh yes, the bit with the pit maze...well, as far as I can remember, basically you do what others have suggested here regarding dopping down and climbing back up stairs. However, I seem to recall that some of the pits
Spoiler
are fake, something you can test easily by attempting to place an item on it - if it seems to stay hovering above the pit (rather than disappearing as it falls down), that pit is fake and you can walk on it safely
.
I'm also not sure, but I think this is the point where you can
Spoiler
"cheat"
, because there is a
Spoiler
fake pit
somewhere around that lets you
Spoiler
sneak around to another side of the Corbum Pillar and grab that piece too :D
.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Er... no. You're talking about the Corbum Pillar pits. We're talking about the Pit Maze on the upper ROS way prior to the Corbum Pillar area. :wink:
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Ameena »

Oh, I thought the go-up-and-down-pits bit was the bit in the Corbum room, lol. Oops, shows how well I remember CSB from the last time I played it ;).
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

RE- Death Row

Ahhhh......I forgot to ask about that.
What is Death Row? I saw a door awhile back in Ros that was locked.
Death Row was written on wall.

Trying to find a way through a pit maze

Adventure Log#23

DDD-ROS

No progress tonight sadly.
Im stuck in this annoying area with the pits.
I just keep falling into pits that lead to the Dragon Maze in Ros.
The only thing i can do next time i play,is to create notes of every pit and where it leads to....and eventually,i'll chance upon a pit that leads me to the corbum.
This is proving to be a very frustrating part of the game.
Romero and Carmack NEED to re-group.Modern gaming needs to be saved from the greedy bastards who are ruining it all.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Re Death Row: it's a place where you end up if you screw things up in the "zoom" area. You can't enter it "properly" from the Scorpion area in ROS - the door can only be opened from inside. If you have some time, save your game and go there just for fun to see what's there (leave the "zoom" ride in different places and sooner or later you'll find the "right" pit). :)

Re Pit Maze: again, as I said earlier. Make two maps (one for the upper and one for the lower level), overlay them and look for squares in which a pit on the upper level corresponds to a solid ground on the lower level. Jump into that pit and continue. After three (I think) these jumps you'll be on the other side of the maze. It's not that hard - the area is actually quite small (not more than something like 8 x 10 squares or even smaller). The solution is hard to describe in words, really, I would have to navigate you step-by-step.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by oh_brother »

I don't think I actually ever went to death row. Now I am curious as to what is inside.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Ameena »

As far as I can remember, all that comprises Death Row is just
Spoiler
a small room with a Stone Giant inside, and apparently no way out (though presumably there is a secret button or something to open the door - I can't remember)
.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Gambit37 »

Death Row only opens when
Spoiler
you use Lockpicks on a keyhole in the Zoooom area of ROS on the DDD. Lockpicking opens the pit you're standing on
.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Paul Stevens »

There are two ways as I recall. Using the
Lockpicks opens the pit under you. But
using the correct key lets you in without
opening the pit.

Playing the game with the alternative
goal (CSBwin) forces you to find all these
rather obscure corners of the game.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Gambit37 »

I thought that Death Row pit only opened with Lockpicks. If you use the right key, doesn't it open the door in front of you (which doesn't lead to Death Row, but treasure)?
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Gambit is right. :wink:
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Paul Stevens »

Ah! Yes......I remembered something about having
to use the keys in the correct order if you want
to accomplish the alternate goal of visiting every
corner of the dungeon.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

ROS CORBUM FINALLY FOUND

Adventure Log#24

DDD-ROS

Was finally able to get through that damn maze of pits tonight.
What a complete bitch of a time iv had on this part of the game.
Grabbing the corbum took awhile too,because there was a switch i missed initially which closed a pit.

Saved my game upon grabbing the corbum,and then tried jumping down pits.
The pit took me to the games starter room with the Purple worm hybrids,(Along with the worms,A new monster type had taken residence in that room too since i started the game.Looked similar to a Beholder) I just high tailed it out of there and jumped down the pit prior to supplies for the quick.
Im thankfully back at Junction of ways now.

Back into DDD next,to find the next way path.

-Weapon Notes-
Found a new weapon tonight called a 'Side splitter'.It was under corbum area along with a piece of RA armour.The armour sets dont seem to make any difference to fireball damage,so i haven't been wearing them.I have dumped the pieces that i have found on my travels at the Junction for Dain
Romero and Carmack NEED to re-group.Modern gaming needs to be saved from the greedy bastards who are ruining it all.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Well done! One corbum to go! And it's the easiest one! The end is close! Well, relatively close because there's still the upper-most level. But surely they wouldn't make it the hardest level in the game, would they? :wink:
lord soth 75 wrote:A new monster type had taken residence in that room too since i started the game.Looked similar to a Beholder)
Yeah, it's the equivalent of the DM's Beholder, here it's called "Flying Eye." It only inhabits the Supplies for the Quick area and its surroundings. You must have already noticed that every creature from DM has its CSB counterpart (except for the pathetic Rusters). So, there's one of your favourite species whose cousins you haven't met so far in your adventure. But don't worry - you'll meet them. :twisted:
lord soth 75 wrote:'Side splitter'
It's my favourite weapon. Its location is random so I always feel lucky when I find it close to the beginning of my adventure. It's the equivalent of DM's Delta. As with the monsters, each of the DM weapons has its CSB cousin.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

Jan wrote: Yeah, it's the equivalent of the DM's Beholder, here it's called "Flying Eye." It only inhabits the Supplies for the Quick area and its surroundings. You must have already noticed that every creature from DM has its CSB counterpart (except for the pathetic Rusters). So, there's one of your favourite species whose cousins you haven't met so far in your adventure. But don't worry - you'll meet them. :twisted:
A graphically very poor equivalent of DM's Beholder.
The damn things (Flying Eye's) look like something out of the Jim Henson puppet workshop. :)

I am impressed by the graphics for the Hell hound creature though.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

A walk in the park,followed by a walk in HELL

Adventure Log#25

Diabolical Demon Director
Got the 4th Corbum!!!!
I gotta say the 2nd part of Dain was pathetically easy compared to the others.
As soon as you unlock the Dain door,you are straight to the corbum pillar. :o
The DDD gave me the most problems again,and i noticed how once again the blatantly obvious had been staring me in the face.
That portcullis that had been puzzling me so much only had to be opened with an open door spell,which released a demon.The demon once released closed the damn pit that had been baffling me ever since i entered this part of the dungeon.5 items on a pressure plate gifted a square key.Used the key in a lock in the wall.Fought past more Demons and fire elementals prior to finding the door to Dain.

Level 1 (?)
Saved my game,and went up the stairs to level 1.Opened the RA door and stepped into a blue haze.
Now....I dont know whether i am in the wrong place or not,but there is groups of invisible materializer creatures here and iv noticed the Purple worm hybrids too.
I keep falling down those god forsaken invisible pits as well.

Located a 2nd pair of 'Boots of speed' in a very busy area that is swarming with Demons.
Tried to fight against them,but it seems like they are re-spawning (im not sure).To add to the chaos there is a giggler running around in this chamber as well.Iv got 7 magic boxes in inventory,but its not enough time for me to kill these demons.
I haven't got a clue where to go next because there is too many creatures in this room,and whenever i backtrack i end up falling down pits.

Very frustrating.
Romero and Carmack NEED to re-group.Modern gaming needs to be saved from the greedy bastards who are ruining it all.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by beowuuf »

I think the are triggers for the critters, I'm sorry to say. But yes, it is a bit of a nightmare. You should be able to thin the herd if you can find a stairwell to spin around on.

The aim of the game is to throw the corbums in to the FUL YA pit. Sadly, this close to the end, Lord Chaos managesd to release himself from the Grey Lord as the corbum gets more unstable, so you need to avoid him and destroy it.


Anyway, there are demons further inside in a large hall, youare trying to get in to that area. I beleive you are looking for a room with a master key in the central area, and that will unlock the FUL YA pit later. There is a mechanism aroudn to help deal with some of the dangers. Then look for the FUL YA pit entrance near the edge of the area.


Good luck!
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Oh, yeah. Welcome to hell! :twisted:

Entering this level from the DAIN path and using this teleporter behind the RA door is actually the easiest way because it takes you very close to your objective. Unless you've managed to get lost again. :wink: It's very easy to get lost here. Once you find an area full of demons and worms, you're very close. You can either go there directly and try to clear the area - or you can wander around trying to find another entrance (that exists but is very well hidden*) with the danger of getting lost, falling down a pit or creating more demons, worms and Zytaxes (the CSB "materialisers").
lord soth 75 wrote:Iv got 7 magic boxes in inventory,but its not enough time for me to kill these demons.
Do you have the Eye of Time? It has the same effect.

I won't say anything else unless you ask for an advice because I don't want to spoil it for you. Good luck! :D

* Remember the Winged Key passage in DM? There's a similar passage here.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Ameena »

I can remember that last time I did this, I used
Spoiler
a hidden passage through a fake wall, which led me in presumably "the back way", entirely avoiding the room with all the demons and stuff
. I did get attacked by
Spoiler
Lord Chaos
whilst trying to sort out my inventory -
Spoiler
panicked and grabbed the first available item from my pile of stuff on the floor, a Ful Bomb, and threw it at him
.
Spoiler
I was somewhat surprised by the result :D
.
Anyway, yeah, bit of a busy place, the top level. There's a really cool sword (
Spoiler
the Dragon Fang, this game's equivalent of the Inquisitor, I believe
) sitting in an alcove somewhere, but it's surrounded by Worms if I remember rightly.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Paul Stevens »

the Dragon Fang, ... sitting in an alcove somewhere, but it's surrounded by Worms
No need to engage those worms however.
It is possible to simply run past them, grab
the Fang, and exit.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by lord soth 75 »

DEMONS

Adventure Log#26

Level 1

I cannot get past these freakin Demons.There is simply too many of them.
At one point i managed to use multiple magic boxes to freeze them long enough for me to look around the room,and there is a black door here...But none of the plethora of keys i have in my inventory fit the damn lock. :evil:

@ Jan
I haven't seen anything during my playthrough called 'The eye of time'. What level is it on?
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Gambit37 »

One of the
Spoiler
Demons has the key you need.
There is a useful "weapon" you can construct on this level to thin them out a bit.
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Re: Playing CSB for the first time-Will need advice

Post by Jan »

Re: Eye of time: Always remember that in CSB, "what level is it on" is not the best question. :wink: Honestly, I don't know. It might be one of the items that are randomly distributed around the dungeon. Anyway, it doesn't really matter that you don't have it. It's just a "multiple freeze box", that's all.

Re: "black door": you mean a door with a black keyhole? If yes then Gambit answered it. If no then I don't know.

If you're unable to defeat the demons, you can, as I said, use a secret "back door". It's well hidden. Head to the
Spoiler
south-east as far as you can. Once you find a corn and a bread lying on the floor, you're close to the entrance. Walk around a bit here and there and keep coming back and sooner or later an entrance appears
.

EDIT: Alright, my trolls made some further research, and, yeah, the Eye of time can be found in the
Spoiler
Dragon Den (upper KU)
. And the "Black door" is the right door. I thought it was RA but then I realised it was actually Solid Iron, i.e. "black" (or grey to be precice) but I didn't remember! :shock: :oops:
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