all monster characteristics

[Adamo]

if anybody wants to compare all monster`s properities on one table...
I hope it is visible on your screen (code list). It is on mine (lines are displayed ok). If not, change the screen resolution and try again.

Code: Select all

ID NAME     ARM B.H  Hpr A Msp Asp STR POI SR X1 AW CR X2 BR SK TL X3 MR PR AL SS ST

00 Scorpion 55  150  55  4 8   20  150 240 3  5  1  1  11 9  9  2  6  7  8  4  5  2
01 Slime    20  110  20  3 15  32  80  15  2  3  1  3  9  10 3  3  2  4  14 4  8  3
02 Giggler  50  10   110 0 3   5   10  0   6  7  3  1  10 0  1  7  5  3  2  2  2  2
03 Eye      30  40   80  5 10  21  58  0   10 0  2  3  10 10 6  9  12 3  11 3  1  1
04 Hound    45  101  65  4 9   8   90  0   4  5  5  1  15 15 8  5  4  3  10 3  4  1
05 Ruster   100 60   30  3 20  18  30  0   2  3  2  1  8  3  3  4  3  8  5  5  6  2
06 Screamer 5   165  5   6 120 10  5   0   1  1  1  1  1  15 0  1  4  6  7  2  15 2
07 Rocks    170 50   10  4 185 15  40  5   3  6  4  1  4  12 5  2  3  14 6  4  15 1
08 Rive     15  30   80  6 11  16  55  0   3  2  4  1  4  6  6  4  8  12 15 6  1  1
09 Golem    240 120  35  3 21  14  219 0   3  2  0  1  15 15 11 3  7  15 15 3  15 4
10 Mummy    25  33   40  3 17  12  20  0   4  2  2  1  7  9  4  5  5  1  15 3  8  4
11 Flame    45  80   60  1 255 8   105 0   4  1  3  1  5  10 5  5  9  15 15 4  1  1
12 Skeleton 22  20   80  4 7   7   22  0   3  1  0  1  6  9  5  6  3  6  15 2  3  1
13 Coualt   42  39   88  4 5   10  90  100 3  4  3  1  4  3  7  5  8  3  6  2  1  1
14 Vexirk   47  44   90  5 10  20  75  0   5  3  3  4  2  5  9  13 11 5  3  4  6  6
15 Worm     72  70   35  4 18  19  45  35  1  10 10 1  11 10 5  1  3  9  11 3  5  2
16 Antman   28  20   41  3 13  8   25  0   3  4  3  1  8  4  1  2  1  2  3  2  3  3
17 Muncher  180 8    150 4 1   16  28  20  2  3  4  1  13 15 9  1  4  0  0  2  1  1
18 Knight   140 60   70  4 14  6   105 0   5  0  0  1  15 15 10 7  10 15 15 3  4  1
19 Zytaz    15  33   65  5 5   18  61  0   8  5  2  3  7  7  12 10 6  5  15 7  1  1
20 Water    75  144  50  3 25  25  66  0   1  8  3  1  9  7  6  7  7  10 14 5  4  3
21 Oitu     33  77   60  4 7   15  130 0   2  9  5  1  10 6  9  6  9  5  8  4  2  2
22 Demon    68  100  75  3 10  14  100 0   4  4  3  4  9  15 13 1  13 5  10 4  2  1
23 L.Chaos  255 180  130 5 12  22  210 0   9  6  3  6  7  3  15 15 15 11 15 4  6  5
24 Dragon   110 255  70  4 13  28  255 0   5* 4  6  2  12 7  15 1  13 12 6  5  4  4
25 L.Order  255 180  130 5 12  22  210 0   9  6  3  6  7  3  15 15 15 11 15 4  6  5
26 G.Lord   255 180  130 5 12  22  210 0   9  6  3  6  7  3  15 15 15 11 15 4  6  5

ARM - armour
B.H - base health
Hpr - hit probability
A   - attack type
Msp - move speed
Asp - attack speed
STR - strenght
POI - poison
SR  - sightrange
X1  - unknown/unused 1
AW  - awareness
CR  - spell casting range
X2  - unknown/unused 2
BR  - bravery
SK  - skill
TL  - teleport
X3  - unknown/unused 3
MR  - magic resistance
PR  - poison resistance
AL  - attack lenght
SS  - status speed
ST  - attack status speed

* - for CSB; in DM dragon spellrange is different

INFO (from ADGE readme - credits for rain`):

ID (IDnum): The number of the monster for identification purposes. Unknown use.

ARM (Armor): The defense value of the monster.

B.H (Base health): The base health value of a monster. This value will be the base value used when calculating how much health a monster has when created via a monster generator actuator.

Hpr (Hitprob): The base value for calculating whether or not a monster's attack hits or misses.

A (Attack type): This value dictates what kind of attack the monster uses. Here is a compiled list of what each value represents, but is not 100% perfect nor tested:

1: Damage is modified by victim's anti-fire value,
2: The armor of the victim is halved when calculating damage (never used in original game, however can be used in custom games),
3: "Ordinary" attack,
4: Deals piercing damage (see armor editor),
5: Damage is modified by victim's anti-magic value,
6: Damage is modified by victim's wisdom value.

Msp (Move speed): The minimum amount of time required to pass before a monster can move again.

Asp (Attack speed): The minimum amount of time required to pass before a monster can attack again.

STR (Strength): The base value for how much damage the monster inflicts.

POI (Poison): The amount of poison inflicted when the monster successfully hits a character.

SR (Sightrange): How far the monster can see, used in AI calculations.

X1 (Unused1): Unused/unknown

AW (Awareness): How far the monster can automatically detect the player and persue them.

CR (Spell casting range): How far the monster can be to attack from a distance (cast spells).

X2 (Unused1): Unused/unknown

BR (Bravery): The monsters resistance to warcry/blow horn/brandish/etc.

SK (Skill): The base value of experience that the monster gives.

TL (Teleport): Not sure exactly, but when set to 15, allows the monster to "teleport" a few squares away (i.e. lord chaos).

X3 (Unused1): Unused/unknown

MR (Magic res): The resistance to magical spells/effects, 15 = immune.

PR (Poison res): The resistance to poison effects (poison cloud/bolt), 15 = immune.

AL (Attack length): Amount of time to display attack graphic.

SS (Status speed): probability of L/R mirroring and changing its X/Y shiftgroup in the same monster status (front), 15 = never changes L/R and X/Y.

ST (Atk Stat Spd): probability of L/R mirroring and changing its X/Y shiftgroup in the same monster status (attack), 15 = never changes L/R and X/Y.

[Sophia]

In looking at this table, I've noticed a mistake, and it seems to exist on the DM Encyclopaedia as well.

After looking at the CSBwin source code, though, and analyzing the functions to replicate them in DSB, I think the currently existing references have "Strength" and "Hit Probability" backwards.

What is currently known as "Strength" is used in compared to the character's Quickness (essentially, their dexterity modified by their load): so it is much more of a hit probability. As might be expected, then, what is currently known as "Hit Probability" is used as the base value for how much damage the monster does: much more of a strength.

[Adamo]

I took all values from ADGE monster editor. But it seems you`re right, Sophia! Right now giggler has strenght 110, Hpr 10.. golem has strenght 35, Hpr 219. Muncher str 150, Hpr 28. dragon has strenght 70 and Hpr 255.. It doesn`t make sense, it shoud be backwards!

**********************************

ok, table updated

[Adamo]

Flags table:

Code: Select all

ID NAME     AAS PBR AEP LEV NMT 1/4 1/2 DRI APR CSI CSD ATF

00 Scorpion  .   .   .   .   .   #   .   .   #   .   .   .
01 Slime     .   .   .   .   .   #   .   .   #   .   .   .
02 Giggler   .   .   #   .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   .
03 Eye       #   .   #   #   .   #   .   .   #   .   .   .
04 Hound     .   .   .   .   .   .   #   #   #   .   .   .
05 Ruster    .   .   .   .   .   #   #   .   #   .   .   .
06 Screamer  #   #   .   .   .   .   #   #   #   .   .
07 Rocks     .   .   .   .   .   .   #   #   .   .   .   .
08 Rive      #   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   .   #   #   .
09 Golem     .   .   .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   .
10 Mummy     .   .   .   .   .   #   .   .   #   .   #   .
11 Flame     #   .   .   .   #   #   .   .   .   #   #   .
12 Skeleton  .   .   .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   #   .
13 Coualt    .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   #   .   #   .
14 Vexirk    .   #   #   #   .   #   #   .   #   .   .   #
15 Worm      .   .   .   .   .   #   #   #   .   .   .   .
16 Antman    .   .   .   .   .   #   .   #   #   .   .   .
17 Muncher   .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   #   .   .   .
18 Knight    .   .   .   .   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   .
19 Zytaz     .   .   .   #   #   .   .   .   .   .   .   #
20 Water     #   #   #   .   #   #   .   .   .   .   #   .
21 Oitu      .   .   .   .   .   #   .   .   .   .   .   .
22 Demon     .   .   .   .   .   #   .   .   #   .   #   .
23 L.Chaos   .   #   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   #   #   #
24 Dragon    .   #   .   .   .   #   .   #   #   .   .   .
25 L.Order   .   #   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   #   #   #
26 G.Lord    .   #   .   #   .   #   .   .   .   #   #   #

AAS - can attack from all sides
PBR - prefer back row
AEP - attack every position
LEV - levitates
NMT - nonmaterial
1/4 - short 1
1/2 - short 2
DRI - drops items
APR - absorb projectiles
CSI - can see invicible
CSD - can see in darkness
ATF - antitelefraglismness

INFO:

AAS (Can attack from all sides): Monster can attack from front, back and side positions.

PBR (Prefer Back Row): Monsters that have this flag set will tend to hang back in the back row, whereas other monsters will step up to the front row when the party is near and they want to attack.

AEP (Attack Every Position): This flag allow monster to attack character on every possible position (NE, NW, SE, SW).

<note: if If PBR and AEP flags are not set, or a 25% chance regardless, monster move to the front>.

LEV (Levitates): The monster will not fall through pits.

NMT (Non Material Monster):
1. Non material monster ignores (walks through) every kind of closed doors (including RA doors).
2. Non material monster can be hit only by vorpal/disrupt.
3. All items and projectiles (except dispell) pass through the monster.

1/4 (Short 1): adds 1/4 to door animation goes farther under a creature

1/2 (Short 2): adds 1/2 to door animation goes farther under a creature

DRI (Drops items): The monster will drop a preset list of items, specified in the monster drop editor.

APR (Absorbs projectiles): When hit by any item, the monster has a chance to automatically carry the item until death.

CSI (Can see invisible): The monster can see the party when under the affect of the Invisibility spell.

CSD (Can see in darkness): The monster's visibility is unaffected by the light level of the dungeon (In darkness, monster's sightrange is normally lowered)

ATF (Antitelefraglismness): If a monster is moving to a square with an active teleporter that teleports monsters and the destination does not allow that kind of monster then it prevents the monster from entering the teleporter.

[Sophia]

Thanks Adamo. This is helpful.

One question:

DMB (Dumb): The monster is considered "dumb" and attacks a random character whether it is in the front row or the back row. Why I chose dumb to represent this variable is because the code actually makes them dumb!

What do you mean "actually makes them dumb"?

[Parallax]

Where does this table come from? It looks really weird to me. What behavior does the DIS flag dictate with respect to dispells that places rives and screamers in the same category, different from the category that contains flames and dragons? Am I even reading this right?

[Adamo]

@Sophia: you should ask rain`, this is all taken from the ADGE readme what I did was just putting all possible values into code tables. Oh, and working out what`s AAS for. I wanted to compare every aspect of monster behaviour with another, but the descriptions are made by rain`.

@Parallax: again, a question to rain`. But I think (but that`s my theory!) "IF THE FLAG IS SET, MONSTER IS IMMUNE TO HIT BY WEAKEN NONMATERIAL BEING SPELL" instead of "if this flag is set, all projectiles except dispel will pass right through the monster". So it seems there are mistekes in http://dmweb.free.fr/?q=node/783 encyclopedia description.

******************************************

Parallax, I changed that value in the table; now it seems more sensible


oh, BTW:

SHO (Short): The monster is short, and the door animation will go down farther while this monster is under it.

do you think it fits to the giggler, hellhound, ruster, screamer, rock pile, vexirk and worm alltogether? As far as I know, only rive, water, zytaz and Flame (theoreticly, cause flames doesn`t move) can pass through the closed doors. But it fits more to V/D flag...


Maybe the description of 5th flag should be "can pass through closed doors (except RA) AND only hit by vorpal/disrupt... if so, the function of 7th flag would be unknown..

[Adamo]

I made a few experiments with changing the flags and looking at monster`s behaviour.

1. "Short" flag works exactly as rain` described

2. 5th flag "only hit by worpal/disrupt" doesn`t work as described; there`s a mistake in ADGE monster editor. When that flag is set it means monster can walk through EVERY closed door - including RA (!) When unset, every closed door stops the monster. I know that for sure - change that flag, turn the game and you`ll get know (flags table updated).

[Parallax]

The SHO flag seems right to me. The monsters in that group are indeed all small so it makes sense that these are the monsters for which the door closes to about half-height when bashing them, as opposed to the general closing only a bit.

As far as what is now the WTD flag is concerened, I felt it was appropriately labeled as it was before. These are the nonmaterial monsters, or monsters damaged by dispell/disrupt, or whatever you want to call them. For all I know, blocking nonmaterial beings could be a property of doors.

As for the NHI/DIS flag, if really NHI is what it is, then you should be able to kill a giggler, a hell hound, a screamer and a rock with DES EWs only, but not a black flame nor a water elemental. I'm not saying it's wrong, but it begs for a test...

[Adamo]

hmm. I will make a test for NHI flag, cause I`m not sure..

anyway, as for the WTW flag; it doesn`t work that way! In fact, EVERY kind of monster can walk through visible-nonblocking walls IF HE SAW YOU DID IT no matter he`s got any flag on or off. Checked.

As far as what is now the WTD flag is concerened, I felt it was appropriately labeled as it was before. These are the nonmaterial monsters, or monsters damaged by dispell/disrupt, or whatever you want to call them. For all I know, blocking nonmaterial beings could be a property of doors.

no. Every monster with that (5th) flag SET, walks through every kind of doors. Every monster without that flag SET cannot walk through any types of doors. Tested.

******************************************

as for X1? - X4? flags; they`re concerned with displaying the creatures graphics, not it`s behaviour (it`s for WORD4, not WORD2). My mistake, sorry, they shoundn`t be in that table. I`ll remove them later.

[Adamo]

table updated for NMT (nonmaterial flag):

NMT (Non Material Monster):
1. Non material monster ignores (walks through) every kind of closed doors (including RA doors).
2. Non material monster can be hit only by vorpal/disrupt.
3. All items and projectiles (except dispell) pass through nonmaterial monster.

[Joramun]

I don't know if it's a RTC bug or not, but I must say
I remember it also from DM PC : when you shoot a
dispel at a materializer that is in it's "less materialized"
state, I think it goes through it.

[Adamo]

flags code list updated:

1. the "only hit by dispell" flag is really responsible for falling down the door animation (while a door closes over the creature) to 1/4 of its side. Tested.
2. the "short" flag is really responsible for falling down the door animation (while a door closes over a creature) to 1/2 of its side. Tested.

Reasuming:
- when 6th flag is unset and 7th flag is unset, the door isn`t animated at all (but creature still gets a damage),
- when 6th flag is set and 7th flag is set, the door is animated from 1/2 of its size to 3/4 of its size,
- when 6th flag is set and 7th flag is unset, the door is animated from the top of its size to 1/4 of its size,
- when 6th flag is unset and 7th flag is set, the door is animated from 1/4 of its size to 1/2 of its size.

[beowuuf]

Yeah, dispel goes through materialiser if it isn't solid, thagt's why Vorpal blades are so darn handy!

[beowuuf]

Screenshot Adamo wanted me to post:

http://www.dmjump.net/wyslac.jpg

[Zyx]

You're doing a great work Adamo, please continue : )

[Paul Stevens]

Indeed. This represents hard work and is very
much appreciated.

[ChristopheF]

I also appreciate your work adamo, and will update my web site with this new information.

[Adamo]

thank you for kind words !!!
one more thingie: the rive values you can see on a screenshot are NOT the original values used in DM/CSB. I changed some of them for the needs of testing, so that`s why it looks so weird (for example rive doesn`t have "nonmaterial" flag set, etc).

@Christophe: please wait a while with updating encyclopedia untill I consult with rain`; there might be a bugs somewhere. For example I tested nonmaterial monsters and they actually go through the closed RA doors, materializers absorbs dispells in every state and can be always killed (*), etc. I need to confirm that.

(*) - at least in CSBwin, wchich is the ST version; maybe that was changed in later versions

[Adamo]

it seems that "teleport" function on the picture you can see in Beo`s post (ADGE monster editor) is not really responsible for teleporting. I think teleporting is hardcoded. I changed that to 0 and Lords still teleports; except that, I cannot force any other monster to teleport, even if every fuctions and flags are set exactly as Lords values.

The same with making visible wounds in close fight; while there is a chance that rockpile will do the wounds (most likely legs), it is impossible for screamer to do it, no matter of the known and unknown values I set (I changed them all). So it seems it`s also hardcoded.

About 2nd flag; I give up. I tried to figure out what it does, but loose 8 hours.. If you have some ideas, what is it for (Screamer, Vexirk, Water, Dragon and Lords has it set), go on tell me - I`ll try to test it. I can tell you what it is NOT for; not for "walk through walls". In fact, it doesn`t depend on ANY function or flag, whether it`s set or not. Every monster can walk through walls IF HE SAW YOU DOING THAT (so in fact it depends of its sightrange). Tested.

Still don`t know what are X1, X2 and X3 values for. I had LOT of suspections, made a lot of tests, but all of them failed.

[Paul Stevens]

The teleporter value in word 16 is used in exactly
one place in CSBwin.

If a monster is moving to a square with
an active teleporter that teleports
monsters and the destination does not
allow that kind of monster

AND the value in that field is
greater than 9

then we prevent the
monster from entering the teleporter.

So a value greater than 9 prevents a
monster from committing 'teleporter suicide'.
Perhaps it needs a clever name.
'TELECIDE' ? 'SUIPORT'? Come on....
anyone can do better than that!

It seems to be treated as a flag. Less
than ten or greater than 9. The original
designers must have had a bigger idea
since they set aside an entire 4 bits and
put a 'break-point' of 10. 'Self-Preservation'?
'Careful'? 'Timid'? 'Reckless'?

[beowuuf]

Antitelefragglismness

[Adamo]

thank you!
Flags code table updated. Do you think I should then remove "teleport" function from the monster`s properities?

[Zyx]

some bits (like invincibility) cannot be changed through ADGE with the checkboxes, you have to change the word2 or word4 directly.

So copy word2 and word4 from Lord Chaos to another monster, and see if he teleports.

[zoom]

http://www.dungeon-master.com/forum/vie ... hp?t=23942
maybe this helps adamo in editing "invincibility"?


I just wondered whether the monster colour properties should be somehow
incorporated into that above list.
(you know loading one monster after another changes colour etc.)

What do you think - should that be included?

Look at
http://www.dungeon-master.com/forum/vie ... hp?t=24201

However, which monster uses what colour ? Has it sth. to do with monster ID?
http://www.dungeon-master.com/forum/vie ... hp?t=23605

[Adamo]

Monster`s invicibility can be modified as a flag directly through CSBuild. This is the additional option made by Paul (as far as I remember there was a little risk of crash with modifying this one). There was no need for invicibility in original engine. You could just erase the whole monster using transparent colour and replace with existing one using ADGE - and he would be invicible. But CSBwin has only 26 monsters in total, so that`d be a waste (cause we don`t know how to edit this limit - it is hrdly hardcoded; same for the limit of wall decorations etc). That`s why Paul added that function to CSBuild I believe.

Monster colours shouldn`t be added to the list, I think. Most monsters has their own 9&10 colour palettes. But then you can use only one special monster per level. Colour 9 an 10 are fully editable through ADGE monster graphics editor - you could make 2 various colours (instead of pink and orange) for each level, but nothing more; in original DM, there are only one "special" monster per level. Otherwise the colours wouldn`t fit and the monster would look strange.

Zyx wrote:

So copy word2 and word4 from Lord Chaos to another monster, and see if he teleports.

unfortunately, I don`t know how to do this I`m not good with editing the file structures

[Zyx]

you can change the word2 and word4 in the very same screen you've been using to check/uncheck the monsters abilities under ADGE.

[Gambit37]

Zooom, your second question suggests you haven't understood how the colour assignment works. It's nothing to do with monster IDs, but it's everything to do with how their palette data is setup for the colours in slots 9 & 10.

Adamo: Your claim about monsters looking strange on different levels is a little off the mark. If you're clever about how the monsters use the 2 colours in their bitmap, you can create multiple variations of "special" monsters by clever selection of monsters on each level.

Anyway, good work on your investigations -- impressive stuff!

[Sophia]

After digging around through the code, I've been able to determine that the mystery "???" flag is a sort of "prefer back row" flag.

Monsters that have this flag set will tend to hang back in the back row, whereas other monsters will step up to the front row when the party is near and they want to attack.

Why the dragon and chaos have this flag set, I don't know. It could simply be vestigal, or (and this is pure conjecture on my part with no evidence from the code) they could have some internal "row" data that determines whether they like to shoot missiles or do melee attacks. More investigation will probably be required...

[Adamo]

flags code table updated !

PBR flag: so, if there are 3 water elementals on the tile, two will hang back as long as possible because they can attack from the back row.
If both these flags (2nd and 3rd) are not set, or a 25% chance regardless, monster move to the front.