Dungeon Master Forum

Someone help me before I pull out all my hair..

1. I can't find the way into the council.... To me it looks like I have to get through the black door in the fifth hall - do I need the powergem for that?

2. I can't figure out the puzzle on the top level, where you have two pits leading to the temple, with a closed portcullis behind one, and a disappearing wall behind the other, which when disappeared reveals a intermittent teleporter. Feel like I've tried everything - is it possible to get in there?

3. In the emerald forest, am I supposed to show some particular item(s) to the eyes, or am I supposed to just go in and kill everything?

4. Is there anything to do in the future machine besides get a key?

1) There are some clues in the prison about how to get there.

2) Yes, just throw small things, like in the Ros level in CSB.

3) killing everything is good enough.

4) nothing else, except the fun of holding your own skull and some obscure alternative for one of the endings.

I know I didn't give much. I'd rather let the players exchange their knowledge.

Hmm, okay well here's another one

5) Is the dark councillor immortal?

Anonymous wrote:Hmm, okay well here's another one
5) Is the dark councillor immortal?

6) Are the spitters in the emerald forest immortal? Is there a trick to surviving? Anything else to do down here besides get the dragon armor?

I'm pretty sure all the Councillors are immortal. Zyx feel free to correct me though .

5) The Dark Councillor can be defeated - look at the Oracle for a hint on how to do it.

6) Well, you don't go into a forest to chop down all the trees, do you?

6) Some spitters make good firewood, which burns just grate.

6) Are the spitters in the emerald forest immortal? Is there a trick to surviving? Anything else to do down here besides get the dragon armor?

It depends which party you are playing with. If you're playing with the correct party, you will have received some hints before you get to the forest.

Hmm, you lot are almost as cryptic as Zyx himself!

Gambit, you're just confusing me... possibly on purpose... ... the spitters actually seem to stop spitting for a few seconds when I blast em with a fireball, but I thought that was just my imagination. And what do grates have to do with it? I need a bigger hint!

I did manage to kill a few spitters down there, and found a spot with some kind of smoke that doesn't go away, but died before I could investigate. My team is pretty strong now so I can last pretty long down there, until I run out of mana. Anyway, I got the dragon armour at least so I'll go do something else now.

Ian, yes I probably should have followed advice and taken Leif/Iaido/Zed/Gando ... is that the party you're referring to? The party I have is Iaido/Leyla/Gothmog/Halk, so I guess I missed out on a lot of the in-game hints.

Trantor - my hint oracle returns an error, I think the powers that be may have removed it in my version? As for chopping down trees, only if they spit at me... don't tell me I have to map this place!

Thanks everyone for the help, such as it is.... heheh... although I have to admit it's almost as fun trying to decipher the comments as it is trying to solve the puzzles.

Chewbacca wrote:Hmm, you lot are almost as cryptic as Zyx himself!

Hey I think Chewbacca just gained a spamming level!! I think you get more experience if you make lots of useless posts so I'll sit here for a few hours and build up my levels until you all cower before me hahahahha

Chewbacca wrote:Hey I think Chewbacca just gained a spamming level!! I think you get more experience if you make lots of useless posts so I'll sit here for a few hours and build up my levels until you all cower before me hahahahha

Just kidding!

lol (I was going to put this line in another post but thought that would be pushing it)

There's another hairy beast that is archmaster in spamming. We're quite used to it now and we all have developped high resistances to this kind of strategy.


The oracle mentionned by Trantor is inside the game, somewhere at the council's level.

Alright,

I've abandoned the emerald forest for now and am up in the prison, looking for clues to get to the council members. I was just thinking the clue is probably on a scroll, which is probably now in a pile of scrolls in my treasure room, when I happened across two I'd left behind.

One says the Dark Councillor has absolute power over the council.

The other, which was originally in a cell, presumably with the first, says "He sent me to trial with no reason."

Are those hints? There are still plenty of closed doors in the prison. Three, anyway.

Chewbacca wrote: I was just thinking the clue is probably on a scroll, which is probably now in a pile of scrolls in my treasure room,

Okay actually i found one in a pile that says something about reflection to fix something and it sounds like it's referring to a gem now instead of a person so mirror ... but i can't use the mirror on the gems, so what - do i use the mirror on the gem slot in 5th hall/

I'm still stumped on how to get to the council. I went back up to that damn door in the 5th hall again, used mirror on gem slot, tried all my gems again (I have 4 colours, lots of each) but it won't open. Is this even openable? I think there was a scroll around here saying something about a powergem, which again I have no idea...

I was pretty stupid with that top-level puzzle - thanks Zyx. All kinds of good stuff up there if I'd found it when a normal person would find it. I guess what I have to do though is start over and take Zed and Gando... do I need Leif? I had him for a while in my trial game but he was almost as quiet as Iaido.

Leif and Iaido are way openers, while Zed and Gando are information givers.

Leif is very strong but doesn't give you anything that you couldn't get anyway.
Iaido can lead to unique areas.
Gando, if you discover how, can give you access to the next 3 grades of his guild, and with his gift of tamiel, his a very decent wizard.
Zed has a very useful item.
You don't need a guide more than another, they just help you uncover some secrets. As for the emmy forest and the correct party, you won't find it if you took one of the guides.

Personnally, I find Leif a good pick for a quick start, Iaido a good pick for an easy venturing (lots of doors you can open without caring about the keys), Gando an excellent choice for early strong spells, and Zed the best choice on the long term.

However it's not a bad idea to start over at some point. Once you've got an idea of what is ahead, you can design a strategy for picking your party, which is very important and will affect the whole gameplay.
You can choose to pick only one guide and 3 leaders later, or start with a whole school so you can blast everything in your way, or try to discover the hidden characters' features, etc.

You need the powergem for the 5th hall, which was stolen.

To get an audience with the council, you should find more hints in jails. You can try to reach the remaining cells by falling into them from above.
There are at least 2 ways to obtain an audience.

The scroll about reflection is found in the retirement room and its meaning applies there.

Zyx wrote:Leif and Iaido are way openers, while Zed and Gando are information givers.

Wow thanks for all the info. That stuff about the guides is great.

Zyx wrote: To get an audience with the council, you should find more hints in jails. You can try to reach the remaining cells by falling into them from above.
There are at least 2 ways to obtain an audience.

Well, I already obtained an audience and proved my innocence if that's what you mean. My problem is I can't get into the council room. I've mapped all around it, above and beneath. Above, there is a spot I haven't explored, and above that is an unexplored area behind the powergem door, so I figured there was a pit or stairs in there somewhere.

Sorry, just to clarify, I'm talking about the kill the council quest.

Zyx wrote: Gando, if you discover how, can give you access to the next 3 grades of his guild,

I got to the next grade without using a corbum, but it doesn't work again. I tried throwing some magic at the door too and that didn't work either but of course it was lo-powered, if that matters.

Chewbacca wrote: I got to the next grade without using a corbum, but it doesn't work again. I tried throwing some magic at the door too and that didn't work either but of course it was lo-powered, if that matters.

Oh... do you mean the Ra way + fireball downstairs + his own corbum = first 3 grades?

You don't need to post 4 times in a row, just press the button EDIT of your last message.

No, I mean the Inquisitive mind way + Ra way + his own corbum.

Let me tell you that I won't tell you which is the "Inquisitive mind way".

You didn't get an audience, you went to trial. That's good. You already got through half the trouble to meet the council.

Who's a scruffy looking nerf herder?

Personally I always found Leif on his own a good starting choice - powerful, starts with a good weapon (I personally take the mace for quite a while) and it leaves you three slots to fill as you desire with higher level charatcers later. But the first games it's good to have all the guides, just for the sheer amount of info and help you get

Zyx was giving a subtle hint, but since we can't have two hairy spammers, then I will be a bit more explicit - You should have found some reference by now to proving your innocence, and how many times it is actually required...

There should be a second scroll somewhere, by a spy I think, mentioning another way to do with a big cross...this way can be found if you have ventured deep into the emerald levels (not emmy forest, the emerald key lined way at the start of the stairs before it

Zyx wrote:You don't need to post 4 times in a row, just press the button EDIT of your last message.

But I gain experience more quickly my way!

Zyx wrote: No, I mean the Inquisitive mind way + Ra way + his own corbum.
Let me tell you that I won't tell you which is the "Inquisitive mind way".

That figures. Inquisitive mind, huh? Hmm. I guess it's not in the order of presentation though? I could only get Ra working on the first one, not the second..

[edit] oh wait... inquisitive mind, wasn't that part of a scroll?

Zyx wrote: You didn't get an audience, you went to trial. That's good. You already got through half the trouble to meet the council.

I think this is the subtle hint Beowuuf is referring to, i.e. I have to go back to prison. I can survive another trial by leaving both crowns in the alcove, and I do remember seeing a message that my certificate had expired... I guess I have to experiment some more. But the main thing I have to do is visit those pits I think he was talking about... forgot about those cuz I wanted to be sure I had enough emmys.

[edit] Actually, even if Beo was talking about that line of pits, I only have three emmys left which I don't think is enough... and anyway screw it I'm starting over with the 4 guides and see what happens...

Do those two things and all will be made clear, and the council will be yours to contend with

Chewbacca wrote:

Zyx wrote:You don't need to post 4 times in a row, just press the button EDIT of your last message.

But I gain experience more quickly my way!

Zyx wrote: No, I mean the Inquisitive mind way + Ra way + his own corbum.
Let me tell you that I won't tell you which is the "Inquisitive mind way".

That figures. Inquisitive mind, huh? Hmm. I guess it's not in the order of presentation though? I could only get Ra working on the first one, not the second..

[edit] oh wait... inquisitive mind, wasn't that part of a scroll?

Zyx wrote: You didn't get an audience, you went to trial. That's good. You already got through half the trouble to meet the council.

I think this is the subtle hint Beowuuf is referring to, i.e. I have to go back to prison. I can survive another trial by leaving both crowns in the alcove, and I do remember seeing a message that my certificate had expired... I guess I have to experiment some more. But the main thing I have to do is visit those pits I think he was talking about... forgot about those cuz I wanted to be sure I had enough emmys.

[edit] Actually, even if Beo was talking about that line of pits, I only have three emmys left which I don't think is enough... and anyway screw it I'm starting over with the 4 guides and see what happens...

[edit] make that 3 guides... I'll take Leif, Gando and Zed cuz I probably already heard about all Iaido has to say and mapped his areas already I think... probly missed some actually[/edit]

yes, it's in the order of presentation

beowuuf wrote:Do those two things and all will be made clear, and the council will be yours to contend with

d'uh... what?

Um, oops about the extra post? I'm such a dumbass with these forums.

[edit] argggh!! not again! chewbacca get angry

beowuuf wrote:Do those two things and all will be made clear, and the council will be yours to contend with

Which two things? [edit again] You mean: 1- go to prison again, 2- go to place by emmy forest lined with emmys

[edit some more]

zyx wrote:yes, it's in the order of presentation

So if I can't figure it out, does that mean I don't have an inquisitive mind?
[/edit]

yup

[edit] Oh no!! I'm out of keys and there's one pit left.... shouldn't have opened the forest I guess? Only wouda missed out on plate.
The doors out the side of the stairway down to the tower entrance are just for certain characters right? No emmys in there?
[/edit]

Wow I just found that wall in the mines.... that's the coolest thing i ever saw! how'd he do that?

[edit later] Okay I finally killed the council.... never found that way b4 cuz i didn't want to give up my crown lol