Dragon Plate on "Supplies for the quick"

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:50 pm

Just had some funny things like Dragon Den, Monster Flood II and so on. Then I arrived to a place with some demons. One had Master Key. Master key opened a lock and I went inside. There seemed to be place called Fulya Pit.

Hint Oracle said something about 4 Corbums. I only have one.

I can guess you can get those four from Junction Of The Ways's 4 paths. I haven't completed any other path than Ku from that place you can choose your way. I may have run one or two other paths for a short time ( Didn't bother to consult Hint Oracle about what those text's mean and first time I didn't really figure out that you can choose your path ) and so but got soon teleported back to level where is this Junction Of The Ways-teleport. From Ku-path I got one Corbum.

Very annoying, when you really must choose what to carry because one character cannot carry very much even with 6 chests. Those keys and Magical Boxes ( 14 ) take very much space. Altough they are light to carry.

It seems I chose totally wrong ways along this journey. According to Hint Oracle, this Fulya Pit is the place to "foil chaos's plan". If chaos is the major boss, I'm in totally wrong place at this time.

Well, maybe I just have to find way back to Junction Of The Ways.

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:13 pm

You can go to the ful ya pit whenever you want, usually people wait til the end. Find the routes to get back to the Junction of Ways - you can use that as a store area, then carry on through the paths to collect the other corbums

Post by **PaulH** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:22 pm

Hmmm. For a 1st run through a new dungeon, I would say taking more than one character is a good idea for capacity.

And I think having dud items and dead ends/failures is part of the game. If there weren't any, and every item had a use, it would be a little predictable i think.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:32 pm

Ok.

Now I have to find a Dragon to test this brand new Dragon Fang.

Easy to guess that it is...

1. Very awesome against Dragons

Or

2. Using it against Dragons does damage to you or something like that :)=

Let's see what happens.

Some people say this game is "impossible" or something like that. I'm playing CSBWin AtariST ( Exact conversion of original?? It seems to be much like same compared to one that I played on Amiga ) and have to say, that so far Dungeon Master Java's first two levels gave much more real challenge than CSB so far. Using one character and maximum difficulty of course.

Maybe those "impossible" dudes should play that game. Haha :)=

Post by **PaulH** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:35 pm

Or play Conflux hehe..

Suule · Post by **Suule** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:37 pm

Conflux makes even the toughest man break down crying.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:41 pm

PaulH wrote:Hmmm. For a 1st run through a new dungeon, I would say taking more than one character is a good idea for capacity.

And I think having dud items and dead ends/failures is part of the game. If there weren't any, and every item had a use, it would be a little predictable i think.

One character is quite enough altough I have no room to carry all Iron Keys, Dragon Steaks and other less valuable magic-items. I only have Magical Boxes and Eye Of time. No room to carry any Teowands and similar staff's. So far I haven't needed any Magic-items that has limited amount of uses.

Oh yeah. It is great to have some totally fluke-places. But if you need Solid Key and Oracle says you can get it from XXX-Dragon, you use Solid key, enter, there reads Ku in the wall ( Ku-path ) and oracle says you should do like this, there seems not to be any other good paths to continue and so on, it is hard to believe this corridor can be "just another corridor" without any proper use.

There has been many FO-places so far all of those were most ovbiously non-critical.

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:52 pm

You see, CSB is different. It is not so much about
finding the right key to open the next door. It is about
learning the dungeon itself. You managed to get to the
Ful Ya pit. That is the end of the game the way I play
it. But you are still totally lost. Getting rid of that 'Lost'
feeling is pretty much the object of the game, I think.
And it is not easy. You cannot just follow your nose as
you do in DM. And the Hint Oracle will not suffice. It takes
a LOT of searching, adventuring, and exploring. And when you
have finished, you still will have many things to discover.
When you finish, try the alternate (Find all the dungeon's objects)
way of playing. That will convince you that you have not yet
seen it all. I doubt that anyone in this forum can give a reasonable
outline of more than about 60 percent of level 0, for example,
without referring to a map or notes.

Fortunately, there is infinite food and water. And you can take
your time and enjoy the trip. Each discovery will make you want
to find one more interesting fact about the dungeon.

And throw those boxes away. I never use even one of them.
They make life simpler in a couple of places but they are not
needed and are difficult to carry with one Champion.
And throw away the Iron Keys.

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:06 pm

Why throw away when you have 12 accessable floor tiles on the Junction of Ways to create little piles on : ) Food one pile, iron keys anopther, bombs another, misc keys another, chests another, misc items like torches another, useless weapons/armour another, useful weapons/armour you arent' using on another - it's liek a little home : )

CSB is so cross-connected and non linear that half the fun is learnign it, and doing as much as possible - you can complete the way to each initial way key without touching two parts - but then where is the fun in that, lots of nice little tricks and puzzles along the way

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:14 pm

12 accessable floor tiles on the Junction of Ways

Do most people keep thing there? I always piled my things
in the room upstairs where the water is. That is where the
"Fetch all Objects" game expects them. I suppose it is pretty
much a toss-up since you can get from one to the other
quite easily.

I don't know why I collect that junk. I know I won't use
it. Must be some sort of psychological problem.

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:17 pm

Lol, me too - the Confux II dungeon is even more embarrassing - but at least there is more floor space at the guild to dump things

The junction of ways is an easy spot to dump some of the supplies for the quick /start room stuff too - and it never gets picked up afterwards, just built upon!

Suule · Post by **Suule** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:20 pm

Paul Stevens wrote: Do most people keep thing there? I always piled my things
in the room upstairs where the water is. That is where the
"Fetch all Objects" game expects them. I suppose it is pretty
much a toss-up since you can get from one to the other
quite easily.

I don't know why I collect that junk. I know I won't use
it. Must be some sort of psychological problem.

I used to collect all misc items in DM1... and I mean all - Corbamite, maginfieres, gems, coins, necklaces...

Trantor · Post by **Trantor** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:43 am

Interestingly, I almost always collected every single item in DM, but never stored anything anywhere in CSB...

I agree with Paul and Beo, learning the dungeon itself and how it works is what makes CSB so special. The game is extremely non-linear, and thus, the whole experience of playing CSB is very unique to me. I recently played it again for what must have been the 10th or 15th time, and I STILL found out something new (a shortcut in ROS and the Death Row for the curious). Really great game.

Post by **PaulH** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:24 am

I cannot understand how one character can be 'quite enough', yet you complain about lack of space! (HJP)

You shouldn't be using the oracle yet... not if you are as intrepid as you seem...

Am I missing some point here?!

Post by **Ameena** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:45 am

Which character is it anyway? One carried on from DM or one from the CSB prison?

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 8:33 pm

PaulH wrote:I cannot understand how one character can be 'quite enough', yet you complain about lack of space! (HJP)

You shouldn't be using the oracle yet... not if you are as intrepid as you seem...

Am I missing some point here?!

Well, I just use that Hint Oracle, if I'm "stuck" or want to know if there is endless monster supply and things like that. Like that Dead End-thing and Monster Flood II. Stabbed 20 worms with dagger ( I was only Expert Ninja so I needed more levels ) and there seemed to became more and more. So there was endless amount of enemies, just like Oracle said. Then I started battle with Executioner. On the other hand, on one Ku Path-room there was nice amount of Blue club-dudes, but not an endless amount ( This time I didn't need to use Oracle ). My mouse hand got quite tired stabbing those dudes with dagger ( More Ninja levels of course ) and when I used Executioner Berserk, remaining dudes ran away. So I continued using Dagger. I Didn't move just for not to step over any triggers and such.

Sometimes it's stupid to play without sounds. Usually I play sounds on, but this time it was quite late, so I switched off speakers. Then I pressed 2 buttons ( And probably door opened nearby, but I didn't hear that ) and third button right away. Then Armor-Sword -dude teleported behind me and start hacking I was stuck in the corner. Well, that wasn't very hard situation anyway.

No, I will not use Oracle if I can figure out what is the point in some way. For example that Safe Teleporter was very nice, but I checked that name from Hint oracle after I used it. Just needed to kill some Demons first. In most cases, I haven't used oracle at all or use after I'm "done".

Sorry, I don't know what "intrepid" means.

Which character is it anyway? One carried on from DM or one from the CSB prison?

My starting character seemed to be Itza. Just wandered around some time randomly and took the first one I noticed ( After wandering ). From CSB Prison of course. After that I noticed that there are at least false wall, but I needed to press button to open door. I think you cannot do that without single character and when I decided to complete game with one character, I didn't bother to see if there was something behind door. I think there should be, because I only found 22 characters ( Might have calculated worng ) and on DM there was 24?

About those items, I want to carry everything with me so I do not need to worry if some enemies ( That stupid small green stealer for example ) takes my stuff from the ground.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 8:44 pm

On that Hint Oracle there seems to be many "pages". That "name" tells something sometimes, then you do not need to click more info. For example that Monster Flood II-name told just enough. I didn't need any more info, just that there are endless amount of enemies if you don't do something. I don't know what exactly stopped that flood. I killed 3 demons and one Stone club dude on lower level and flood seemed to end. Strange. Maybe it was just killing those Demons or Stone club dude.

Oh yeah, dictionary says that intrepid means like "brave".

I don't know what you mean. I just play because this is fun. Only those "dropping X levels down from hole"-things are not so fun. Or have been so far.

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:43 pm

So there was endless amount of enemies,

Well, they are not 'endless'. And, unless you enjoy stabbing
worms with a dagger, there is no need to fight all those
silly worms. One is enough if you know how. It is part of
learning the dungeon.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:02 pm

Oh yeah, somehow I managed to stop them generating. But just when just standing and stabbing there seemed to be endless amount. Or?

Post by **PaulH** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:07 pm

My point was you seemed to like hard dungeons/harder scenarios, so I thought you have refrained from using the hints and tried to solve everything without. Which would be impressive! This dungeon has many secrets and tactics, evidently shown through the speed runs.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:13 pm

PaulH wrote:My point was you seemed to like hard dungeons/harder scenarios, so I thought you have refrained from using the hints and tried to solve everything without. Which would be impressive! This dungeon has many secrets and tactics, evidently shown through the speed runs.

Oh yeah. I like challenges, but also want to have fun. It's not fun to wander around five minutes and then notice that you should have loaded previous save because you screwed up ( Dead End-thing, as explained previously ). Another thing is this Monster Flood II. I just wanted to know is there is something I must do to stop those worms generating. My mouse hand got quite tired.

When Oracle topic was "Monster Flood II", that clearly said, that I must do something else than just bashing. Just enough. Still I don't know what exactly stopped that flood.

I also didn't figure out how to get Speed Boots from Fulya Pit-level. That stupid door just didn't open. Well, I'll get back later.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:17 pm

Sh*t, I just figured out ( Or remembered ) that there was an "useless teleport" on Fulya Pit-level ( Speed boots ). On Ninja-path there were just similar ( Throw item and it teleports on pressure plate and opens the door ).

Maybe that is not the solution, but...

Pretty much travelling to get back there.

This is fun!

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 11:10 pm

This is fun!

Good. And there is plenty more where that came from.

Pretty much travelling

If you don't cheat (and learn by doing) then you will get very
accustomed to traveling. Back and forth and back again.
Fortunately, it is possible to do this a lot without generating
new monsters. The DDD is a bit of an exception and is a pain
to traverse many times. Going backward from upper levels is
simpler if you find the right pits to jump into.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:26 pm

I "completed" ROS Path ( Or at least I think so. There were 2 doors I wasn't able to open ). There were some nice tricks like that "Give up.Pull the lever". NO! About 20 throws later that problem was solved. After that it took some time to figure out what next. Then I noticed Torch in the wall. There seem to be quite few Torches in the game so very hard to guess what to do. Yeah, I remember starting room. Those yellow "Scorpinos" probably were supposed to be killed with trigger-fireball thing, but I think I gained more EXP killing them with knife. At least I got one Ninja-level more.

( Of course nobody wants to know about my character, but if you do, screenshot ( Just after killing those Scorpions ) there: http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/7379/dm45ng.jpg )

There was about 5 Dragons. Most of them were very easy to kill. Just one 6 4 4 spell was enough for some.

After some time I had some difficulty to choose between waapons; Executioner or Diamond Edge. I took both for a while. Then I arrived that stupid DDD-place again. There must be something to be done. Anyway, I stepped into wrong direction and dropped ( One? ) level down. There was a Dragon. After some bashing, I accidentially dropped my Excecutioner, pressed wrong ( Keyboard ) button and dropped to starting room or near that.

Back to Junction Of The Ways. This time NETA-path. After some wandering there was a room with 4 floor triggers and a door. At last a good, logical, and hard problem!!

First of course blast door with fireballs. No help. Next some bashing. No good.

Some wandering and some pit droppings later...

No keyholes or secret buttons so there must be something with those floor triggers.

So let's throw ome daggers over all triggers. That doesn't seem to work. Next try to step those triggers one by one like "fast running-mode". No.

Some wandering. This is stupid. Let's see if there are something elsewhere. Back to stairs and there seem to be some WC-paper guys ( Wasn't there before ). Let's check those trigger places once more. Every door has a button so all those doors can be closed. Also there is no room to move so that you do NOT press the trigger if door is closed.

Oh yeah!

Simply the best problem so far in the game. It took about 10 minutes to solve, but that was very logical. Altough I didn't find that monster trigger immediately but nothing is perfect.

After some wandering I was again in front of DDD-stairs. I want my Executioner back! So let's drop from same hole as previously. Dragon is still there. After some Berserking that wussy Dragon tried to escape. I managed to trap it in the corner and after 15 berserks later that was clear job.

I found a door that led to "Supplies for the quick"-place. I tried to get back, but door was closed.

So next DAIN-path and solve that DDD-things later.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:19 am

((( Hmm. At DAIN-path there seems to be a lock that "should" eat Gold key ( At least it looks like same as many other Gold key locks. ). But it doesn't. Tried several times but no luck. Strange. )))

Closed this window and got back to http://www.dungeon-master.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=28 page. My eyes accidentially catched magic word on one topic that explains everything. Now I just need to find that item...

Hope you don't get frustrated reading my monology :)=

Post by **Ameena** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 4:39 am

Lol not at all - I'm finding it quite amusing actually. It's cool to see what someone thinks of CSB who's never played it before. Lol you see the Mummies as being wrapped in bog roll. I never even thought of that - since they're Mummies I always just saw it as bandages hehehe.
And hooray! Someone else who likes to kill Dragons!

I tend to kite 'em round in a room rather than hem them in a corner and hack them to bits (can't normally take more than one or two Mon Fireballs from those guys anyway and their teeth hurt too) but it's still fun. No shortage of food for you unless you leave all the dragon steaks behind and then can never find the place again

.
Get used to the DDD. It's a pain but you'll be there some more. As you said, there's still some stuff to solve there.
Half the fun of CSB is the running around with no clue what's going on and then going the wrong way, falling down a pit or something, no idea where you are, but after hours you eventually hit on something and get a new wep or something or solve a puzzle and it actually feels like you're making progress

.
And when you said you had Executioner and Diamond Edge...Diamond Edge isn't in CSB is it? Thought it was just DM? Sidesplitter I think is the CSB equivalent...I found that at Supplies for the Quick once which was cool

.

HJP · Post by **HJP** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:32 pm

Nice to know.

On that topic page I see 6 topics, lowest is "Death Row and **** *****. Hehe. That explains what I need to find.

Diamond Edge: http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/1671/de17yc.jpg
and http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/5613/de28xz.jpg

Those game programmers are simply AHs :)=

For example that "Prove you are a wizard"-thing took some minutes to figure out. Maybe solution was told somewhere I didn't visit? Also Bridge-thing was very quiote annoying especially when falling down the pit I immediately found RA-key lying on the ground ( It wasn't there before ). Anyway. After some tries ( Also Door opening with a spell, that seemed to be useless ) I simply looked around after pressing the button and...

Trantor · Post by **Trantor** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 7:38 pm

I agree with Ameena, reading your experiences and thoughts is a lot of fun. The whole Couatl-level in DAIN is in my opinion the most confusing part of the game (not counting everything in level 1). Have fund at the DDD and beyond...

Sera · Post by **Sera** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:56 pm

Suule wrote:Conflux makes even the toughest man break down crying.

may have been a while since that was posted, but er... i havent been broken down into tears yet ;) apart from the fact that im frustrated with puzzles, fighting isnt a problem for me

Sera · Post by **Sera** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:00 pm

Trantor wrote:The whole Couatl-level in DAIN is in my opinion the most confusing part of the game.

i really couldnt agree with you more trant, DAIN in my opinion is by far the worst of the 4 ways