High walls and no ceiling

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High walls and no ceiling

Postby Leslie » 6-Apr-17 13:12

Hi guys,


does anyone know how I can make a dungeon without a ceiling and walls reaching to the top of the screen? Something that resembles a deep cave where you can't see the ceiling while walking on it's floor.
Any idea?
Many thanks in advance!
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Ameena » 6-Apr-17 13:29

I suppose just draw some ceiling art with the graphic that you want, and replace the default ceiling with that?
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Gambit37 » 6-Apr-17 17:48

It's been years since I've used RTC, but the basic idea is:

+ take a copy of the ceiling bitmap
+ fill it with black and re-import it
+ design a set of walls that fade to black at the top *

* This is not a simple task.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 6-Apr-17 20:00

Depends exactly what you want Leslie.
Can be done in various ways, and my latest (unfinished) dungeon has a few examples.

If you want fading into blackness, Gambit has already posted.
If you want the walls simply to reach the top of the screen, then you can either take snapshots of each section of wall and add to it, or stretch the bitmap a little.
Stretching works okay with the DM2 Cave wallset, as you don't have to stretch too far to cover the ceiling. However, it doesn't look good when you do it with stone walls (for this, I took the DM2 stone wallset and added to it).

Also, Linflas' RTCWM program supports tall walls. It would be even quicker with this, but can become a little hazy.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Leslie » 7-Apr-17 07:19

The effect I'd like to have is the one Adamski created for ToC in some locations.
Junius' chamber is a good example. You see the floor and walls reaching to the top of the screen, but you don't see any ceiling.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 7-Apr-17 07:58

If you want to use an existing wallset, take a snapshot of each section of wall and add extra bits to the top until it covers what would be the ceiling. Be careful with the perspective though.
You can stretch a bitmap vertically to cover it, but on some wallsets it looks a bit weird.
RTCWM also supports tall walls if you don't want to do the nitty gritty, but you may need to alter the texture you use to avoid too much of a stretched look.
Ultimately, I'd say have a play around with different techniques to see what you prefer.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 8-Apr-17 18:22

I cut and paste the sections as you say Saumun, it works great.

Leslie, if you want the effect that Adamski does, you'll find it easier to create each wall section as 448x272, makes it easy to place dimensions and work with in programs like gimp, use guides. When you're satisfied reduce dimensions and file size with compression, indexed to 50 color or less. I'd love to know how Adamski did it to compare methods.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Leslie » 18-Apr-17 11:22

I now tried with the RTCWM (which works always fine for me for "normal" walls) and created high walls with it.
I also managed to create masks to capture the images of the high walls, so until this step it worked fine.
But then RTC declined to use these walls in a wallset, since they fail an inbuild size check of RTC. The dungeon does not compile afterwards :(
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby terkio » 18-Apr-17 12:01

So sad Georges Gilbert does not want to realease the source code.
No doubt we have developpers here that would fix this as well as all known RTC drawbacks.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 18-Apr-17 12:15

I agree terkio. It would mean the world to a number of us. I have been working with Clodius who has been feverishly pounding away at a story and has done up quite a few characters, some with 30 or more bitmaps for animations but because of the limitation he will never be able to use them all without creating too many objects and now what seems to be, file size. It would be a godsend to have George back, RTC needs updates and love which that passion has disappeared, heartbreaking.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 18-Apr-17 13:37

Leslie... I find it easier with RTCWM to save each part as a single bitmap, then load them into the GUI using the coordinates from other wallsets.
I readjust the sizes with a paint program before doing it. They're usually only one or two pixels out, so chopping a couple of lines doesn't make much difference unless it's the edge of a brick or something like that... In which case , I just copy and paste a few bits.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 18-Apr-17 13:39

CS... Are these animations for roaming or stationary characters?
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 18-Apr-17 14:55

Leslie, if you are familiar with GIMP, it can really make making wallsets easy peasy.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 18-Apr-17 15:10

Saumun, I should show you some of his art work. I can't stipulate enough of how useful this will be in both stationary and roaming characters. It's amazing. He has many palettes of characters. He is still learning GIMP, but once he figures out the layer bit he'll take off like a rocket. He uses windows built in graphics at work to play with the characters. He's getting really good at it. It's just a matter of time before the work starts to flow into dungeons. Have a look at this he sent me today, please do not use it.

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this is just an example of the work he continually plugs away at. I got this today. Please everyone, do not use it. He will be posting a chapter soon so others can see his progress. I will delete this pic as soon as you respond.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 19-Apr-17 03:17

The reason I mentioned it, is that you could get around it with swaps if it is a stationary object. I've done a few in my new dungeon. Cloned floor objects swapped through each frame by relays.

The only problem is that it wastes a lot of objects, and is pretty time consuming.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 19-Apr-17 15:16

It is the object count that is the biggest problem, 30 characters with 30 bitmaps each. When all done it probably will use 10% of the object count. This has stopped some of my projects because it would have taken up too much to complete what I was thinking. Slimmed down dungeons with main mechanics only can be carried over which I have not tried yet, but it appears to be the only choice for larger dungeons in order to continue the quest which is based on Claude's Dungeon Master story. We really could use some help completing it. I don't have as much free time as I use to being a grandpa at home now has changed that.

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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Saumun » 19-Apr-17 16:02

Yes, the limit is a pain. For the same reason, my own project will be in two parts.
But even though it was intended to be one, I don't think splitting it is a problem... and I have a method to virtually ensure you cannot play part two without completing part one... so the flow of the story is kept.
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Re: High walls and no ceiling

Postby Chaos-Shaman » 19-Apr-17 22:15

Interesting, you'll have to tell me what you have done.
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