Star Trek Dark

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Chaos-Shaman
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Star Trek Dark

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

saw the new Star Trek, into the dark. a great movie, based on
Spoiler
the old space seed
. 3D was crazy, got arrows in my eyes :)
this one is worth seeing guys
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by beowuuf »

Sorry, put the reference in a spoiler since the film is still so new.


I really enjoyed it too, the cast gel well, Benedict was a great villain, and I just enjoy the feel of these new films. They manage to be fresh yet respectful all the time. Also, very fun in terms of action and comedy. Didn't notice the 3D aside from that starting bit with the natives, actually!
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by oh_brother »

I agree, really enjoyed it. The new cast are very good, and have branched out from original crew (I was never a huge fan of the original series, so having a new cast does not bother me...I still think I would find it jarring if they brought in a new Picard though).
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by beowuuf »

It will be James McAvoy :)
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by oh_brother »

I had to Google that to get the reference! I suppose Picard was supposed to be suave and arrogant when younger, so it could work. :D
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by beowuuf »

Ah, X-men First Class was decent, and Xavier was indeed suave and arrogant!
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

i didn't find the 3D special after the first 15 minutes, it seemed to disappear but still it was a good movie. i enjoy the old classic trek series, it has interesting music, beautiful legs, nice colours and the stories were often about our own struggles but in an alien world or aboard the Enterprise.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Seriously Unserious »

I've loved all the Star Trek series that have come out so far. I haven't seen either of the new movies yet, but judging by your reviews that's something I'll have to change as soon as I can.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Bit »

Must somehow find time for it - won't miss it.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by beowuuf »

Music! I really didn't like the theme to start with back in the first film - I thought it was just another orchestration, yet now I really dig it as a theme, and go 'oooh' when it plays during any scene. Or the start of the film.


Edit: Oh no, we're building it up too much! SU, just go with an open mind :) Basically Chris Pine does his own thing, but plays to the spirit of KIrk very well, Karl Urban is a pitch perfect Bones, and Zach Quintio is wonderfully in the middle, playing Spock well, but just adding a great new energy under the surface. Hopefully you'll smile the first time he says 'live long and prosper' for what he's really saying when he says it :D

Everyone else is cool, there are some canon deviations that are justified well and work, and really just...enjoy...
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Seriously Unserious »

Thanks :) , I'll definitely give it a look when I finally get my money, damn government's taking their sweet time about giving my my student loads this semester... :evil:
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by MasterWuuf »

I watched it tonight. I was let down by the movie. Pike, what did they DO to you? And the 'tear jerking' twist on the way it happened 'the opposite way' in 'The Return of er, you know' made me want to write and complain. I'm still confused, thinking I could never complain about 'any' Star Trek feature, no matter how bad.

Still, I was left almost disenchanted over this movie. Sorry, that's how I felt about it, Trekkie that I've always been.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by beowuuf »

If you have the time, here's a podcast interview with Bob Orci (the 'Trek' guy in the writer's room of the new films) and he basically covers the thinking behind the new films if you are interested

http://www.nerdist.com/podcast/mission- ... k-podcast/
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Re: Star Trek Dark

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I understand this film is a different timeline than the original stuff. That explains a lot, so I watched it again...with that in mind. Much better, with my mind more at ease in the watching. Yeah, I purchased it.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Trantor »

I absolutely loved Benedict Cumberbatch in this. But the rest, well, it didn't really click with me. All the references to that old episode and that old movie seemed like a glorified fan fiction to me. I miss the "feel" of Star Trek, the humanitarian concept. I will concede that Karl Urban is great as Bones.
Not a bad film in my eyes, but just like the first new one, I thought it was ok, but a bit overhyped.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Gambit37 »

I thought it was terrible. After a good start with the first film, they pissed it all away in an orgy of nonsensical CG set pieces, retrograde to the point of absent character development, a plot so full of contrivance as to be unengaging, and an affront to the memory of the original Khan. Absolutely awful stuff.

Can you tell I didn't like it?
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by oh_brother »

Interesting, most people I spoke to had at least vaguely positive comments. I do agree that it was quite self-aware ("Damn it man, I'm a doctor, not a torpedo technician!"), though I enjoyed it. As i said I was never a huge fan of the OS, so maybe that is part of the reason.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by cowsmanaut »

The people with the MOST positive feedback were the ones who had never seen the original. Like my wife who loves the movie.. tells me expectations and memory of the original are the only REAL issues here. You hated the movie, not because it was terrible.. but because you hated the change.. if you take a moment to really be objective, you'll see it's true... and totally understandable. I spent a a bunch of time in the theater thinking "WTF" especially at the end.. however seeing my wife get into it, and knowing she had not really seen the original, I took a moment to see why I was having an issue with it.. and it was mainly due to their "nods" to the original.. and by "nod" I mean taking that moment, spinning it on it's head and saying there.. see.. it's different .. and us saying no.. not really.. that's kinda stupid..
Spoiler
you just changed their place..
that makes me angry.. there's none of the emotion you put into the original where I was sad.. what a total waste.. and then I looked to my wife.. and tears were running down her cheeks.. yep, real ones. *I* was missing the movie and missing enjoying it because *I* had preconceptions on how I felt it SHOULD be rather than appreciating it for what it had.

Go back and read up on the characters.. and take a moment to think it through.. they did a crap load of research on this stuff. Referencing even some of the most rare bits of the lore to tie into how they might behave if circumstances were different.. they did a good job of tying in what Pike meant to Kirk based on how history had changed and how his life had been changed as a result of the new timeline.. they were totally consistent and watching it the second time, I was able to let go of the old movie and appreciate the new movie far more.

There is only ONE thing I can not let go..
Spoiler
and that's the excessive convenience of the tribble thing... there's no motivation for why he was injecting dead Tribbles.. they just needed a way to make him not dead and because of that convenience and the foreshadowing of it and how quickly it came up, it took away from the emotional impact, where as the original had the character dead with all but a glimmer of hope until the next movie came out
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

I grew up with Trek, I came home for lunch and watched it when I was 5. we went home by ourselves back then, heh, I feel old now. I thought they tied it in perfect. I too was not sure at first, but when I thought about it I got over it. since the timeline is changed it is all new now. I wouldn't rate it up there as one of the best movies though. it pales in comparison to movies like the Matrix, so deep in story, way over most peoples heads, and this was another movie where you understood it and liked it, or hated it because it was too much story, too hard to grasp. Star Trek Dark was a walk in the park for story compared to movies like that. I've had the red pill, I know what drove the makers that made that movie. Star Trek needs to grow out of the old style and catch up to today. I felt the same with the Next Gen and all the others that came afterwards. it all comes down to that they keep messing with the time line, it screws everything up... my spouse loves Dark...
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by stewy »

I liked it, not as much as allot of people I know. What I do not like about the latest movies is they make the Enterprise
look like a big "SORRY" pussy. The original series she was the bomb, but now she gets her but kicked every movie.
Oh well life goes on
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Re: Star Trek Dark

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NCC-1701Z hahahahaha, you have a good point stewy :)
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Sophia »

I disliked it, too. It was, perhaps, because of the change, but not because I disliked the idea of change itself. Rather, I disliked what resulted after those changes. It simply wasn't something I found particularly inspiring, and had it been "Random Generic Sci-Fi Movie" I would've still not particularly enjoyed it, I think. The fact that they slapped the Star Trek name on it was just icing on the cake, and didn't actually make the movie any worse in my mind-- it just made the whole thing seem a bit insulting.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by stewy »

NCC-1701ZZZZZ
I like that, Ya hit the nail right on the head :roll:
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

:lol: like trekking down the road.. headed nail, tooth n brush, hale inhale
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Gambit37 »

I agree with Sophia. It's not that I hate the change as Cow's ponders: it was a bunch of other factors, well described in the IO9 article I linked to, but which I'll summarise here:

1) Lazy and stupid plotting with ridiculous contrivances solely for the purposes of (a) pointless eye-candy and (b) fan-service.
2) An unconvincing 'role-reversal' death scene, based on a tenuous not-yet-established friendship built on two movies
3) Disregarding some (or most) of the core tenets of what Star Trek stood for
4) Poorly developed characters

If I hated change, I would have hated the first new Star Trek movie - but I didn't, I thought they handled that one pretty well (despite its own contrivances). This sequel however is just stupid and pandering to blockbuster sentiments, rather than properly developing a new trajectory for the rebooted franchise.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Trantor »

I agree with Sophia, too, she said far better what I was trying to express. The "Trek spirit" got lost on the way, and all the references just seemed like a loud shout of "See, we saw the old stuff and we can prove it!". It never felt like reminiscence or homage.
It's not that I hated the film, but it's just some nonsensical popcorn action flick with a few highlights such as Cumberbatch's or Nimoy's performance. For me, it is Star Trek in name only.

Actually, I don't feel all that much different about the first new Star Trek movie. The premise of the plot seems rather stupid ("Let's wait for 20 years in the shadows to kill one guy when I could instead save my planet from annihilation!"), the whole transwarp transporter is just absurd (why would you actually need spaceships at all anymore?), and don't get me started on Kirk taking command as a blind passenger just because he is, well, James T. Kirk.

My wife and I are currently re-watching the old Trek shows on DVD. We just started season 3 of Deep Space 9, which is actually the first time that I see it (I never got into the show when it was new and only watched the first few episodes). Usually, that's much more satisfying stuff.
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by Chaos-Shaman »

DS9 was my least fave.. it was too dark, the security officer odo just never had anything much. the much later Enterprise series I thought were fun, more of a comedy with a quantum leap than anything. they need to leave Trek alone for a decade and reinvent it once more with the younger generation, the next next generation perhaps. the original is still my favorite series. seeing many of those devices that became reality is just crazy. I still do the vulcan peace sign 8)
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by oh_brother »

I missed all the references, and even the role-reversal. I only got that from the article. Either I never saw Wrath of Khan, or I was too young to have any real memories. Anyway, I think I will go and watch some TNG now!
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Re: Star Trek Dark

Post by cowsmanaut »

several of you lot are either blind to your own prejudice, or hated the entire original series and the STNG and so on.. plot twists without actual logic, women taking off clothing for no reason, poorly developed characters (if you take it one show or movie at a time) and I can go on.

go back and watch the first Kahn movie, and try to forget every episode prior to it. and don't depend on the first movie, because it was a whole lot of poop.. there is little in there to sell the long lived friendship or the richness of the characters.. and in fact leans heavily on the original story and series. William Shatner often accused of being a poor actor.. "of all the souls I've known.. his was the most.. *akward face jerk* human" buhawhawhaw... what the hell was that? all the valid emotion up to that point was ruined for me.. and well there are a whole whack of stupid things in the movie.. here this guy can point a bunch of them out
http://rightbrane.wordpress.com/2012/06 ... es-it-did/

it's easy to pick apart a movie based in fiction, often things are done too conveniently in order to make sure the story goes on.. How many times have seen a show or movie start of with one wrong and entirely unrealstic choice that if avoided, the entire movie would never have existed.. and even when resolutions to the issues arise, they are conveniently swept under the rug and ignored. Heck some movies thrive on the stupidity of their characters.. like every single slasher flick "Oh gee, all the lights are out, and I heard someone scream and gurgle bloody whimpers.. I'll go down into the basement without any form of protection and see.." o_o ...

oh please tell me how this differs from a random bra scene in the movie
Image
and these
http://cdn3.whatculture.com/wp-content/ ... P_0001.jpg
http://blog.buycostumes.com/uploaded_im ... 729572.jpg
http://ca.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire ... 2_copy.jpg

I'm half surprised Kirk didn't bed a gorn.. he slept with nearly ever other alien in the galaxy.. and then there are the repeated "fully functional" android comments on STNG while Troi wears her low cut top/mini skirt and moans and writhes.. and feels.. oh so .. emotional. the Lesbian romances.. planets devoted to sexual acts.. women dominating men.. I could go on with about a thousand other instances and images to go with them.. but I think we can agree, scantily clad women for no reason was pretty common place..

disregarding tenets of what star trek stood for. I see.. the wrath of khan was about the love of a son and his father.. oh.. no wait.. that wasn't really dealt with until the next movie and it was short and convenient there too.. so, it was about human prejudice and how we should see past differences.. oh.. no.. no.. they killed all of the different people.. ok, I know, it was about world peace.. oh no no.. it was about revenge and blowing stuff up.. yeah.. that's what it was..

you know, if voting even matters to you.. go look at IMDB.. the two latest movies have higher ratings than all the previous Star Trek moves before them. Even Rotten Tomatoes (notorious for being harsh on films) gave it a highly favorable rating of 87% .. but you know.. you're not all biased or anything.. :P

Sorry, but it's funny to me.. Many people didn't even try to see the Character development that was there, or the real deep research that shines through. Did you know that Scotty was fired in the original Trek? For a really short time.. just part of an episode. no.. you probably didn't .. but he was.. just as there are a number of deep looks into the personalities of these characters.. How Kirk see's Pike as a father he never had.. which is interesting because Pike passed off the ship to him in the first series as well and had shown faith in him, which on a psychological level would make sense if you grew up with a step dad you hated and finally someone saw your potential, believed in you, tutored and encouraged you.. you would probably feel it too. Admiral Marcus and his daughter.. after the attacks on starships and so on in the first film, when his daughter (carol) would have been a baby, he would have been paranoid, looking to defend his planet.. this would have shifted her interest based on her fathers obsession of finding ways to bolster the earths defenses.. so rather than devoting her big brain to genesis project, she became a weapons specialist to make her dad proud.. I can keep going on here.. there is a strong thread through the entire movie in each character that leads to this all making sense.. the previous series of star Trek have even delivered reasons why Spock is more emotionally driven, given his half human side.. we're seeing his darker impulses more due to the devastation of his planet, mother, and people.. and on it goes..

anyway, the movie had it's good parts and it's bad parts.. and no more so than any that came before it.. if you want to get out your judgement sticks and beat something, at least take the time to beat the snot out of the previous movies as well.. it's only fair ;)
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