Dungeon Master Forum

I thought I would sit down and share with you some thoughts. I have an aproach to life that I've come upon over the last year or so.. it's been slow developing it and nurturing the idea and while it does not always provide me with the calming contentment I always hope it will.. it does it's job well when I most need it.

Emotions are a powerfull thing and there are many that cause us to feel poorly. It is those I wish to address.

From a psychological and mostly logical stand point negative emotions are triggered by environmental stresses. Those stresses are caused by one of 4 potential things.
1. someting completely out of your controll that is standing in your way. Neither sentient nor affected by your emotional stress. So essentially it intends you no ill will as it has none to give.. and there is nothing you can do to change it..
2. your own mind.. you are wrestling with something within yourself and trying to gain an advantage either morally or otherwise. So in essence what are you doing? Fighing yourself? Why? you can grant yourself what ever allowances you wish. It's your life and your morals. Take just a moment to think of the final result. If you've already done something wrong and you are "paying for it" simply remember that again.. nothing canbe done to change the past. simply learn from your mistake and never do it again.
3. someone else who want's to make you feel bad. If this is the case then by responding to them is giving them power over you. The intent is to cause you to act out and to feel pain. You understand the intent and the imaturity behind it so why allow it to consume you? Know that by not responding in the way they wish you will be causing them greif instead.
4. Someone else who had no intention of hurting you. So by acting negatively you are only causing negative responses to someone who intended you no harm. As such you potentially may be hurting someone who cares about how you feel and may be the best person to help you deal with the stress.

So what is the final result? Feeling bad is a pointless waste of time and effort. It hurts, damages, scars, and sometimes even kills a person. Simply take a moment to evaluate why you feel the way you do and understand the cause. Then it's a simple matter to deal with it apropriately so you can get on with your life.

Now.. that said. I know emotions do not allow logic to take the forefront and it's not possible to ignore them always but if you can spare the resources but a moment in the very heat of it you might just save yourself from more stress later on.

All I know is it has changed my life over all. I had suffered from regular depression and even though after a while I overcommed it. I found that I would lapse back to it from time to time. It would kill hours and days and even months of creativity and enjoyment. So the discovery that it really was a waste of time, was simply a good thing for me to learn. I feel I can now weather those emotional storms that would have before taken me out for months and those things that would take me for a day are nothing more than a moment of thought and then cast aside.

There is just one down side to this and unfortunately it ties into those around you. Some people will not understand your reasoning and think you unfeeling in some situations. However, often times an explanation can remedy that.

at any rate its somthing to think about.

I leave you with one more thought.. it seems someone may have said this at one point and I'm just remembering it.. and if not then I'm saying it.

Love like you'll never lose
Live like you're always loved
Treat every moment as if it's both your first and your last.

(if only it were that easy.. but then again.. perhaps it is?)

moo

A lot of stuff you said there...

I don't think it is quite that easy in the end, because you have to transport it from theory into your life, where you will sometimes react and possibly by using old habits that die hard.

On the other side of the coin (flip...flip...) I am positive that the more you reflect upon why and how things happen to yourself, you might be able to stand off at times and see your environs calmer, analyse a bit before you clench your teeth and so on... will not always help, but it will be a step.

I want to add: You can also use this method too much in my opinion. If I were to cross the path of some priest-type know-it-all who'd smile on everything I said and just used soothing, love-spreading words in any conversation no matter what both my interest would be very low indeed to continue that conversation and I'd think he was a stupid bugger not to let his emotions run free at least for a tiny while.

Allright. Now rip me apart

Regards, PitD

As I said, it's not a matter of being a perfect solution. you will still feel nagtively given the circumstances at the time. However, it's a process where you can try to remove yourself from the negative effects before they fully consume you.

As for seeming unfeeling it's not that at all. I do not suggest one does not feel or submit to emotions. There are a great many positive emotions one can explore with complete abandon. There are also those that maybe somewhat negative yet provide release. Vindiction is one. Retribution must sometimes come in order to resolve your feelings.

I mean could one really expect to ignore or remove themselves from the death of a loved one? Or a physical attack? no.. Some things cannot be ignored and set aside. However, for those daily anoyances, arguments, pet peeves, or what have you. There is a chance to side step some of the pain they can cause you.

For that priest by the way.. I imagine he would find satisfaction that you would be consumed by your own emotions from trying to cause him to become agrivated. I mean if your goal is to get a response from him.. then you are trying to cause negative emotions. His choice is to not allow you that power over him. As such if your response is anger towards him for not acting out as you wished.. who gains from that? Him or you? Which one of you is being selfish? If however your desire is not to have him be angered.. then why worry about it? Can you not be glad that one can maintain a level of peace in his life?

It's ok to be passionate about things.. to feel and to express. what is not healthy is to dwell on things for long periods of time. This does not mean you can not turn and tell someone to "F" off once in a while if you think it serves you. It just means if you see yourself mulling over something for a long time feeling like crap.. perhaps you should evaluate why you are feeling that way.

IE. I did not win that T-shirt contest. I could sit here and feel like crap because I was not chose. Or.. I could simply be happy I participated and gained knowledge and practice from it. I know I've matured as an artist due to it and I think I understand the reasons I was not chose. In fact I'm happy about a few of their choices too so I can even be happy for others that won. For me.. not winning is not the end of my life. I'll simply do better next time.

hope that makes it more clear..

moo

I'm on with you for most of the reasoning just thought I'd honor your long post by replying...

just to answer the thing about the priest: I do not wish to cause negative emotions (why would I?), I just expect a certain measure of "non-control" as a sane attribute. People acting (and this choice of word is very deliberate!) controlled, happy and soothing all the time have my distrust and pity, because my experience tells me there is no such thing for an constant period of time. It is the same to me like a fanatic of any other kind, sort of a "negative emotional junkie" if you get my drift. I would not engage in harassing anyone because of that, but I would pity them, yes. For I think this state of mind is a special kind of arrogance (never to be acknowledged of course) and I want nothing to do with people living and acting like that - and to get the discussion going on I'll even go as far as to say I'd value people higher that hit their children because that is more honest in my opinion.

Regards, PitD

P.S.: Before you flay me alive, I step in if anyone does the above mentioned thing when I see it and I try to avoid any brawls or fights myself. This is just for the sake of argument.

This is a very interesting topic and one that is close to my heart.

Feeling bad is a pointless waste of time and effort. It hurts, damages, scars, and sometimes even kills a person. Simply take a moment to evaluate why you feel the way you do and understand the cause. Then it's a simple matter to deal with it apropriately so you can get on with your life

Cow, I really admire your ability to have trained yourself to recognise when things are affecting you and to deal with it accordingly. Being aware of, and understanding, one's emotions and feelings is not something most people are very good at: from an early age, western culture dictates a certain level of detachment from emotions that 'dilutes' us as people. Daily we are bombarded with images that show us how we 'should' be or do or behave. Most intelligent people recognise the damage that these influences can have, but very few really take the time to understand how they make them feel.

I am currently undertaking psychotherapy. I don't mind admitting it, even though some people react strangely when they find out (that's a good example of ignorance at work). I have been doing it for two years, and although it can be frustrating at times, even painful, it is a voyage of discovery that I am glad I started. I think I probably have at least another two years work. The crucial thing that I have learned is that emotional reactions to our situations are often the result of bad habits formed early in childhood. If no-one is there to guide you, to teach you, to love, nurture or care for you, emotions can become distorted and often (as in my case), negatively powerful. If you do this long enough without enough positive influences, it takes over your way of thinking until it becomes normal -- and you end up an adult with no ability to understand your emotions, and crucially -- to deal with them appropriately. I believe that -- to a greater or lesser degree -- this happens to all of us.

I had suffered from regular depression and even though after a while I overcommed it. I found that I would lapse back to it from time to time. It would kill hours and days and even months of creativity and enjoyment. So the discovery that it really was a waste of time, was simply a good thing for me to learn

As you have learnt, the trick is to recognise when you are consumed by these feelings. That's the first stage, and can take a long time. I've needed significant guidance to help me do this, so I am impressed that you have trained yourself to do it. The second stage of course is to then appropriately deal with the feelings, through a conscious choice. It's all about becoming a whole person -- one who has emotions and can feel them properly, but who can use willpower and choice to positively influence the result of those emotions. I admire the fact that you seem to have been able to learn ways of handling this quite quickly -- it's not the same for all of us and can take much, much longer: in some ways I think you make it sound as easy as choosing not to feel negatively, and for everyone it's not that simple.

On average, most 'rounded' people probably learn ways of dealing with this in their twenties. It's often those of us who had negative experiences as children for whom it can take much longer. I'm 31 now, and am beginning to realise how little I've actually lived -- all because of harbouring negative emotions for years with no understanding of why, and no ability to change them.

To quote Yoda: "Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter." The more of us who realise our emotional and spiritual self worth, and learn ways of listening to it and really feeling it, the more peaceful and positive the world will be. The sad fact is that many people harbour negative feelings that were taught to them when they were young, and never find the ability to change.

I could go on about this for days, but that's all I wanted to say here. Thanks for bringing up an interesting subject, and good luck in your efforts.

One point from me for discussion.

The second stage of course is to then appropriately deal with the feelings, through a conscious choice.

Am I the only one here thinking/feeling that emotions are not to be controlled basically ? I think during the course of our lives we are getting changed by many sources that may cause our original instincts to be muted and act in strange ways.However I also hold the firm belief, that I can trust my emotions and there are reasons for them. So I'm not a voter for mind over emotion - why not the other way around sometimes ?

An example: If you see somebody falling down on the street, will you think about reasons to pull him/her off and out of danger or will you just do it?

The way you describe to "handle" your emotions, Gambit, seems fine and suitable, but is it not only a way of getting a grip on them, that could be spared if they were different in the first place, so maybe that this would be the final object to (re-!)achieve ? I think that's something each adult has to work on for him-/herself, by the way... we do not pass the bridge from childhood unscathed both in our hearts and thoughts.

Regards, PitD

You misunderstand me. I'm not talking about controlling emotions at all -- I'm not saying we should all be Vulcans! Perhaps I haven't been clear.

What I'm saying is that many of us do not understand our emotions enough to be able to deal with them appropriately -- that isn't about control, it's about self awareness. I agree with you -- I am a firm believer in the power of emotions as part of our personailty, our very being -- controlling them isn't my aim, but understanding them so that I'm better able to act accordingly: that's what I'm trying to learn and do.

I have been in the situation you described and helped someone who was knocked off their motorbike -- I reacted instinctively to do what I felt was right. If I were controlling my emotions, would I have done that? Maybe not. Who knows? How much of our emotions are tied up in 'instinct'. That's an even more interesting question....

Both, our emotions and our intellect are essential parts of us, and both can err. In situations when emotion and mind pull in different directions it is ourselves, our very own soul, that can choose which to follow or possibly divine the cause of this discord. This ability to make a choice is not a one-time-thing, it is to be applied in every situation anew, it is essentially free will, and we may err there too. Those who stop making this choice anew in every new situation but start to lose one of those two parts of theirs instead are about to die spiritually, to distort themselves, but fortunately it is not a one-way path, although it may be very ardeous to turn from such a path.
Pride or anger or worst of all negative emotions hate and fear may prevent us from truly seeing our own situation and draw the right conclusions, or an overmuch intelectual perspective may cause us to start to think that our mind is all that we are, which it is not.
Yet even those darkened thoughts and feelings do have a place on our lives: They exist to make us learn about ourselves, about who we are and what our true purpose or will in life is. A Character from the "Neverending Story" (book!) by Michael Ende says (translated by myself cause I only have the original German version), that no way is wrong, if it leads to the goal, no matter how twisted it may have been. So even negative emotions may be positive in the end if we learn somthing from them about ourselves. One of the important things to learn is not to torture oneself with thoughts like "If I just had done tisn'n tat..." but concentrating on what can be done now.

Love like you'll never lose
Live like you're always loved
Treat every moment as if it's both your first and your last.

That's a good principle, in tune with the very few ideals in life that I have been able to discern deep enough to bind them into words. They are not rules (There is only one rule which says "There are no rules above exceptions"), but rather guidelines, and since they were written before this thread was opened only some of them relate to this thread, but I didn't want to rip them apart, plus they are the first thing that has been coming to my mind when Cows was asking: "Philosophy anyone?"

Principia Luneveris

God and Goddess are One.
All Goddesses are One Goddess and all Gods are One God.
The Divine is immanent in all and transcendental beyond all.

Do what you will, divine your self, seek harmony, become One!

Live free, have faith, give love, speak truth, grant mercy!

Labour and trade serve art, art serves spirituality.

Do not waste life!
Self-defense is an art, as is hunting.
Never employ violence for other reasons.

Only ever employ deception to prevent injustice and suffering from violence.

Honour traditions with creativity, live the moment, care for the future.

Every paradigm has it’s unique wisdom and it’s unique blind spots.
To comprehend a paradigm is like beholding the Divine light through a single facet of a prism or admiring a single petal of a flower. The Divine comprises all paradigma.

Solving paradoxa shows the path to enlightment.

Gambit: think I understand what you are getting at - free emotions if you are aware of them, reasonable control mechanisms of self-awareness if you are not. 'That a correct plot ? As for

emotions [...] tied up in 'instinct'

- interesting indeed. Can you start with an example you have in mind ?

Lunever: Not that I want to deny the morale value of any of those principles brought up by you (and they all sound very nice, too ;o)), but I strongly doubt anybody can live according to them all. Neither do I or even want to - too "abstract" for me.

As for

no way is wrong, if it leads to the goal, no matter how twisted it may have been

: also tricky stuff. What if I would murder somebody to find my true self/way in life/peace/inner harmony? Would that be o.k. ? Adding, that I love the "Neverending story" very much, book only though.

Regards, PitD

PitD: As I said, they are my own personal guidelines, not general rules.
I don't believe that cruelty to other beings can bring anyone closer to inner harmony. But despite of this that is a tricky question that does not have a generally valid answer. Besides those guidelines are not yet complete, for I intend to add at least something like "don't do to others what you don't want them do to you", but I did not yet find the proper words and are not contend with the above. But time (and experience) will probably bring up the proper words.

PITD you mention societal influences of emotions and instinct. What about those influences to make us feel bad? Imposed morals or what not to cause us to feel as though we have done wrong. Have we really? There are a number of things that cause us to feel things that are based on rules that others have made for us. Don't belch in public, don't talk about sex in public, don't cause a fuss, don't put your feet up on the chair, etc etc. These are small examples but they are easily identifiable. Others are more illusive but there none the less. Feelings of guilt can come from them.. as you feel you've wronged someone. However one has to think about the validity of that. Let us take a common theme.. something that has been going on for years and years and yet no one questions it. While it's not all that big a deal it can be the source of wild arguments. The toilette seat and women.. you know what I mean. Some how.. someone determined that men should not leave the toilette seat up after peeing. However, we have to lift the seat to pee.. and then put it back down after? Why? We would have to put it back down if we needed to do other business. So what exactly is there to say it's our job that it's unfair for us to not put it back down? Isn't it as ridiculous as saying women should raise the seat after peeing? I know this subject matter seems to take things a little off track but rest assured it's not. Many women get *VERY* bent out of shape over this. So much so they would be in a foul mood for as much as an hour or more. Someone I know had a girlfriend who put little sensors on the bottom of the seats (yes they really make these) so it blares an alarm if the seat up is too long. Well.. sometimes when you take a morning piss you might take a little longer.. and if you are half a sleep and this thing goes off.. well. Anyway, the point is that somewhere, someone told us this is the way things are and if you don't do this.. you are wrong. That it gives someone the right to be upset with us.. that would should feel guilt about it. Yet it does not seem valid to me.

moving on

instinct is there to provide us with a reaction to an event it's triggered by. The instinct is more primal, it's at the root of us. It takes over and is much more difficult to control. It is not emotion though it can trigger emotions. It's not what I suggest be controlled. What I suggest is the taming of wild emotions that affect your life negatively and support of those that affect your life positively.

I'd like to mention at this point that there are those who love their "sweet misery" as someone once called it. Some people *need* their negative emotions to feel alive. It's what makes it in their case a survival tactic. It makes for them some negative emotions a good thing for them. Some times it's good to give your body a good cry. It helps cleanse the emotional palette. It doesn't necessarily need to stop your life or cause you grief in the rest of your life. Some little bit of misery or sorrow can be pocketed away into your day week or month as you need it without it taking over your life. So many people do it and it helps them. So you see I don't shun all negative emotions. Again I say one method does not work for everyone. This is only about trying to prevent emotions from engulfing you and taking over your life.

Anyway, life is constant test of your emotions and mind. In order to live in today’s society and survive it's rigors without losing yourself some logic must be applied. People are so horrible scatterbrained and stress runs high as we are expected to more in less time how can one live without some self control? How easy is it for us to misjudge someone’s intentions? I would imagine too easy as it happens all too often. People controlled by their emotions tend to live very difficult lives. So how could a small measure of self control hurt them?

anyway.. I knew this topic would pique some conversation..

moo

Cow, I agree on the societal influences, many rules existing in written or even in unspoken form can and should be questioned because they make no or little sense except making someone feel bad or guilty in hers or someone others eyes if he does not live by them. I think it is generally a good rule of thumb to basically question what I'm doing as often as possibly, because then it will not be so easy to do stupid or needless things, no matter if that is the accepted state of the art or not - but it will influence my feelings about myself definitely.

Ad "sweet misery": not the term I would have chosen, but a familiar one. As a small addition I want to add that this is not a masochistic or self-pitying notion, but an awareness, that both positive and negative feelings are necessary - at least in my case. I'd miss something if I would not feel sad from time to time and I try to embrace those feelings coming up for I think they improve my joy of positive feelings as well.

On the misintentions you're right on target as well, I'd say. Take only language as a reason for uncounted misinterpretations within each day of your life, even with people that might know you very well indeed. Add body language, moods/emotions, different points of view, put in some prejudices, traumata or psychological/emotional damages, connotations etc... and you will have unlimited possibilities to misjudge even simple sentences as "Could you please pass me the sugar". This will not be changed by self control, but it might have less consequences (hurt pride, low self esteem, mobbing and much more) if we all tried to reflect more often on who said what and left out "instinctive" reactions sometimes.

Regards, PitD