Dungeon Master Forum

Greetings,

I'm working on a few replacement graphics sets for RTC. To complete these with any level of quality, it is almost necessary to obtain:

1) A complete List of graphics in RTC

For example:

BITMAP_DOORS_BARS
BITMAP_DOORS_BARS_BROKEN
...

I've attempted to make lists of graphics used by each dungeon, although there are always variations that are not listed such as ALT, SIDE, and scaled images. Without some kind of list, there will be errors and omissions that will be very disappointing to discover after playing halfway through a large dungeon.

2) A complete set of the graphics contained in RTC
Graphics1.dat - Graphics5.dat, etc

Some of the graphics in RTC have been cropped, flipped, or otherwise altered. The source files would be the ideal start for replacing the contents of each image.

Am I correct to conclude that neither of these are available, and than none of the .dat extraction utilities support the RTC .dat files?

Thanks!

We've asked many a time and it's never been forthcoming.

That's not say it can't be done -- you can get all this information from the editor Add/Replace graphics screen though. Everything in the .DAT files is displayed there.

I can't even tell basic things like how many items there are in total. I'm confident that I could create three or four complete graphics sets if I could get this data. Right now, I'm afraid that anything I do will be incomplete.

I'm basically finished with the DM2->DM/CSB dungeon graphics conversion, as far as I can tell, but there is no way for me to verify that I've done a complete job. I just don't want to disappoint everyone by releasing a graphics set that is 95% complete.

Gambit37 wrote:We've asked many a time and it's never been forthcoming.

Would a list of graphic items in RTC be useful to anyone else?

In case anyone is interested, I've posted my list of the graphic items in RTC. I think (hope) it's complete at 3770 lines.

I personally use this to create filenames to help reduce confusion while replacing graphics using the RTC editor, but I add a suffix to each item to identify the specific graphics set (as I'm working on a few):

BITMAP_DUNGEON_TORCH

becomes

BITMAP_DUNGEON_TORCH_DMX

http://home.roadrunner.com/~neurocrash/ ... _18_11.txt

Enjoy!

Brilliant, excellent work, this will be very useful indeed! You have way more patience than the rest of us! Thanks!

I found that some items were missing from my list, probably due to some overzealous macro that I used to clean it up. I've taken the list down and will re-post it once I've fixed the problem.

Cheers!

(cough! cough!) I'm dusting off this project and taking another crack at the RTC graphics items list. I reinstated the old txt file that may be incomplete, but will hopefully be replacing it with an updated version if I can find omissions or errors.

Are you sure you still want to bother?

RTC hasn't been updated in a long time. It might be too much work for an essentially dead project.

Simply put, I know of no other way of to test or use a complete DM/CSB replacement graphics set, than with RTC. This requires that I identify a comprehensive and accurate list of the graphics names used in RTC, which I thought I had accomplished by snooping around in RAM, but somewhere along the way I got stalled because I thought I had discovered some missing entries and didn't know how to proceed.

I would be glad to know if there have been developments that might allow an updated graphics set to be used in any other DM clone or remake, but as I've just been casually lurking for the past three years, it didn't occur to me to use anything but what I started with. I didn't look seriously at DM Java as it refused to scale to full screen, resulting in a tiny viewing window and huge borders.

The goal of this project was to be able to play DM and CSB again, but this time with higher quality graphics than the original 16 color bitmaps. I realize that running DM in 256 colors and/or with the DM2 wallset doesn't appeal to everyone, but since I've already played DM and CSB several times in their original Atari ST form, I'm looking for a change this time around.

I started to experiment by putting together the files to replace the wallset, then worked on the monsters, and eventually resigned to the fact that it wasn't worth doing this without updating everything else that might be found in the dungeon, which I could not do without a complete list of graphics. This is because in order to replace the items RTC, I need to know what it calls them.

As for the ultimate usefulness of this kind of replacement graphics set, I just assumed the only use would be for those still making RTC dungeons, or those that might wish to easily upgrade their existing projects. Obviously when I started this in 2008, there were at least a few RTC works in progress; I don't know about now...

It would be great if these graphics sets (collections of PNG files) could be used by other engines as well. Otherwise, I just want to finish what I've started so I can at least enjoy some dungeons that look a little better to me. I've already put a lot of time into collecting and updating graphics, cataloging, resizing, getting permissions, etc... I just want to complete the project.

Sophia has her own clone, Dungeon Strikes Back. Perhaps your efforts can be diverted and finished there?

Obviously we're dealing with my creaky old memory from three years ago, but it was my understanding that DSB did not support 256 color DM2 graphics. Otherwise, it would definitely be easier to finish these graphics sets with cooperation from the author of a currently developed project.

Thanks

Updated!

http://home.roadrunner.com/~neurocrash/ ... _18_11.txt

There were indeed sections of the dungeon items and doors that were missing from the previous lists, but I think I've located them all now. This now has 4066 items listed, which seems to correspond with the number in the RTC graphics menus, for which I have taken corresponding screenshots for the database. I will be going through all of these again to verify and will update if necessary.

Cheers

The link won't work for me!

Sorry about that - I made a typo when pasting the updated link - it should be fixed now.

Screenshots!

I would say that was worth it.