Dungeon Master Forum

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:58 am**

A clone?
No

A custom?
Again, no

A ...?
no no no

The very first design of Dungeon Master

FTL's DM demo version on the st

was lucky to find it as it was set in a folder without any description on an unknown ftp, containing a graphic text adventure - The Pawn
And then these 2 files : Dungeon.prg, demo.dat

Anyway, it's always interesting to see the difference between a previous release and the final product. I think they did well with adding some minor improvement (specially regarding the top right corner

).

The demo is very short (about 30s), still It's rare stuff (at least, i've never seen it before) and may have some value

Maybe you guys were aware about this curiosity?

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:55 am**

I was aware of the existence of a non interactive teaser demo on ST, see here: http://dmweb.free.fr/?q=node/247#toc7
But I've never seen this before. Could you please put the files somewhere so we can download them? or send them to me by email. I'll add them on the Encyclopaedia? (email address: dmweb AT free DOT .fr)
Thanks in advance!

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 12:26 pm**

very hefty èné! This is cool

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 1:01 pm**

oh well! I guess this is extremally rare stuff! You`re great ene!!!
It`s interesting to see how the game evolved (interface especially) from rather obscure D&D game to the final Dungeon Master jewel... Plus some good ideas like amulets detecting things... and - check it out - you could place the party in nine places of the tile (what a mess!). I guess they changed it because of the monsters (that`d be hard to draw 9 monsters in one tile). It`s Wayne who rearranged the whole interface making it "interactive" (read it in some interview).
Christophe - I guess the demo does not last long and it should be run in ST; could you make a little movie out of it?

From what I see the game wasn`t previously planned to be semi-real-time (take a look at the "fight" or "bargain" interface commands from which I guess that one action is equal to one turn) because there simply were no games like that before Dungeon Master. These guys are great - they did something no one did before! I love these pics...

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:37 pm**

Wow, really interesting. It looks like Bloodwych somewhat. DM probably wouldn't have been nearly as special if it hadn't been done in real-time. So I'm of course glad they changed it. And I am also one of those guys who really enjoy comparing demo versions of something with the finished product.

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:19 pm**

Super cool, I've never seen these either! Nice find!

The interface commands seem to suggest that it wasn't originally real time as Adamo points out. I wasn't aware of this, I'll see if I can find out anything more about that.

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:35 pm**

but what my amulet is for ??

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:43 pm**

Zombie detection. I wonder how many zombies you have already encountered, linflas - or how many you created.

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:47 pm**

The Amulet of Guillaume was created to keep track of that, but the code wasn't implemented in time

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:53 pm**

could be easy to code into DSB i guess

Posted: **Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:33 pm**

Oh, very interesting stuff. Is the demo accessible somewhere? And what was the "bargain" function for? Was some interaction with NPCs planned to be involved?

Posted: **Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:47 pm**

"Bargain" was the action to use when you faced Lord Chaos, you know, to ask him gently to surrender.
It is a good thing they changed that in the final version.

PS: where is this "unknown ftp" !! ???

Posted: **Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:34 am**

I would love to see that early demo as a short youtube-like movie. Christophe, can you record a movie showing old demo?

Posted: **Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:15 am**

I could probably make a movie, but I need to get the demo files first

Posted: **Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:31 am**

Ah, so the Firestaff has called yet another band together....
Do you know the legends, gentles? Or have you stumbled in for destiny's sake?
For listen:
A comet's tail ago, the Dungeonmaster walked these worlds.
A being of chaos, neither good nor evil, he ruled his kingdoms with fearsome
antics, puzzles, and voids, and roamed far and wide to gather mysteries and treasures.
One such was the Firestaff Itself.
The Firestaff! Living, ancient thing, drawing to Itself a hero when It pleases.
Some say the Dungeonmaster was the first to meet Its challenge
--that fierce Lord but a pawn in the destiny of the Firestaff, Its purpose cloaked in shadow.
That the Firestaff compelled the Dungeonmaster to create these catacombs,
and to lock up his treasure in fabled puzzle vaults.
And that it is the Firestaff that bids you here, to test you in the Dungeonmaster's mazes.
That if you succeed--if you live to gather treasure, to fight the horrors within
that Chaos has sired--the Firestaff will make you more than you are now,
something new and wondrous so that It may use you in other, grander, designs.
The legend pleases you?
You accept the challenge of the dreaded Firestaff?

Then enter the vaults of the mighty Dungeonmaster!

Posted: **Wed Oct 20, 2010 4:19 pm**

that is so cool ene. great find. they certainly did improve from the alpha DM.

Posted: **Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:39 pm**

will video Christophe when be ready for it to see the demonstration of Dungeon master ???

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:16 am**

Sphenx found the DM teaser demo èné discovered at http://cd.textfiles.com/suzybatari1/gam ... /the_pawn/
I have added this demo here, along with a video for people who do not want to run an emulator: http://dmweb.free.fr/?q=node/247#toc7
Note that the demo is very short, but it is interesting to see all the differences with the final game.

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:37 am**

Wow, now that really could barely be called a teaser! A text intro and a few forward steps in the dungeon. Not very exciting. Still, I imagine at the time it probably caused quite some interest, since no-one would have seen anything like it.

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:20 am**

ChristopheF wrote:I have added this demo here, along with a video for people who do not want to run an emulator: http://dmweb.free.fr/?q=node/247#toc7

Thanks for hosting it.
Too bad the video won't work for people who also don't want to run Windows.

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:14 am**

thank you Christophe for this video but the demonstration seems very short, Ca allows us nevertheless to see l' evolution of the plays

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:16 am**

I've just sent the demo at dm encyclopedia, but i guess i'm late..

I also uploaded messages about differences between v1.0 & 1.2, i think they will interesse dm encyclopedia as well

this time, it's a different site; it is like a forum but back in the old days - the service is called genie (another thing which i've never heard of)

it is quite funny to read since it was in the good old days, just when dm &csb have been marketed (to see the players stuck in the game and asking all sorts of questions is certainly a real of enjoyment

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:24 am**

thank you èné for all this information

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:14 am**

I just want to add the entrance image from this teaser, where you see walls with smaller bricks!
And there are two faces carved in the stone

As Gambit said, there is no much else to see in the teaser... But I'm sure it will be a great game, it looks nice and neat!

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:03 pm**

Yes, that's a cool screen. When I saw it in the demo mvoie, I thought for a second the whole game would have those walls. Imagine if they somehow had been able to make the whole viewport the game with some kind of popup interface, man that would have been even more awesome!

Note that the right hand carved face remains on the door frame in all subsequent versions of the game, only the left one was lost.

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:39 pm**

yeah, cool stuff !
I personally like the logically somewhat incorrect final dm walls version better than this one (final dm wallset has too few bricks in front compared to distance walls, as Sophia noted in another thread). And it looks quite mechanical, reminds me a bit of all the other games of that area, like Bard´s Tale for whatever reason..looks not as sturdy as it should, more like a shag. (bard´s tale had walls that were - technically - ultra flat, not real walls and more straigt divisions kind of summons that feel for me. And it does not blend all too well with the floor!
nevertheless nice!! ;')

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:39 pm**

This image is indeed very interesting compared to the final image: so similar and so different!
All the left part was cut out in later versions, and replaced by a tree in DM for X68000.
The front doors are wider than in the final version, and the inscriptions on top do not use the same "font".
By the way, has anyone ever wondered if these inscriptions might have any secret meaning? They look like runes of some sort... Should I start a "Quest of the holy door inscriptions" thread?

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:21 pm**

what represent the two drawings in top on the right and left of the door ???

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:49 pm**

ChristopheF wrote:The front doors are wider than in the final version

Actually only one wing of the door is wider than in the final version - the left one, which was cut off later. That explains why the front door never opened evenly in the final version. That always irritated me.

Posted: **Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:15 pm**

I have added screenshots and a text transcript on my web site.

Too bad the video won't work for people who also don't want to run Windows

I know this is not ideal. I have used the same format in the past for other videos of introductions / ending sequences of DM, CSB and DM2. The advantage of this format is that there are no compression artifacts (Smacker uses lossless compression). Modern video codecs do not produce nice results with old pixelated images.
Does anyone know of a better solution to produce videos that would work on all platforms?

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