water elementals

[beowuuf]

The DM original version already has it!
Or, of course, just delete the trigger by the door so you don't even have to throw the staff

[Lunever]

Did I miss something? As far as I remember George considers this behaviour a bug and has declined to make it work like original FTL-DM even in the original-DM-mode of RTC.

Of course I could simply delete the trigger or even delete a bunch of walls, but I would like to know how to reproduce the exact behaviour of of that trigger like in original FTL-DM.

[beowuuf]

*just checked* Oh, I thought we whined and he put it back in ages ago...
Damn, it all depends on what 'on and over' means!

To start with, over meant 'carried by party or thrown, but while this was a way to get around party triggers, restricting it also restricts other possibilities, so i'm thought we asked if he could degrade it so that there was this 'everything over' but also a 'carried by party' option
I remembered this had been done next release, but form the options it wasn't! I only just twigged that all you have is on, over, and on and over

If triggers still only have this option, you CANNOT reproduce the original behaviour...
I don't consider it a bug, they just didn't include additional functionality. Let's face it, if they really wanted to shut everythign down, when you pull the firestaff free you would instantly trigger that blocking effect, or you could have a few additional triggers aroudn the door and corner so you cannot manhandle it or throw it

[PicturesInTheDark]

This comes down to "not reproducable at the moment since the code has no provisions for it" if I read it correctly.

Regards, PitD

[Lunever]

Ok, but leaving the firestaff aside: RTC not having this functionality is really sorry for it would broaden the possibilities of new puzzles for custom dungeons.
George, can you implement such a functionality next release, pleeease!

[beowuuf]

yup, pleeeeeeease, i rememebr gambit and i arguing for this a while ago : )

[Gambit37]

If triggers still only have this option, you CANNOT reproduce the original behaviour...

Duh.... If set to ON, it reproduces DM behaviour, by allowing objects to pass OVER without affecting the pad? ON and OVER is required for George's bug-killing mechanism.

[beowuuf]

ok, my understanding was:

on = place on tile
over = walk over/throw over
on + over = both

so its:

on = walk over/place?
over = throw over
on + over = both

or am i missing the carried by party option somewhere...

[beowuuf]

just checked (computer very slow, needs restarted, but fought with it), and

on = object on
over = object flies over or party walks over (interestingly, object flying over triggers twice, once for eahc quarter tile)
on and over = all the above

So nope, you can't reproduce the original behaviour as it stands : (

I would suggest on = as above, over = party only (so reproduce the original diamond edge and firestaff+ behaviour), over+ = over and thrown over, and you don't need anything else, as who needs the on or over? for the rare time you need both, two triggers would of course suffice

[Gambit37]

I don't understand your logic: If ON means that the object has to be on the tile (placed or carried by the party), then throwing it OVER won't trigger it surely?

[beowuuf]

as it currently stands, 'on' means it physically has to touch the tile, 'over' means when it passes over, either by the party carrying it or by throwing it

there could be four states i suppose, on, carried, over and on+over

[Gambit37]

All this time, I thought George had relented and fixed it -- oh well!

How about it George? Or can you clarify the current operation if we've misunderstood?

[beowuuf]

Incase george had thought it was fixed that way, I tested it using v0.28, and by changing the 'open door' trigger in the DM HoC to something that toggles by a club - i then ran through the on/over/on+over options

At the very least this double triggering by a thrown item is a bug