Objects on tables

[Chaos Awakes]

With tables, if I throw an object it lands in the same corner of the table that it would if there was no table there and it landed on the floor.

If the table is in an alcove - ie, blocked on three sides - there is physically no way of picking up the items on the far side of the table, and if the item is vital to solving a puzzle or completing the dungeon, i'm screwed!

Can we have some sort of system whereby items thrown at a table only land on the nearside?

[Gambit37]

I think artificially controlling the dropping of items in this way isn't the way to go about it and could cause other undesirable behaviour for people who want the current behaviour.

Maybe it would be possible for GG to add code to check if there are walls on three sides and then only drop the item on the nearside.

[beowuuf]

Surely you can put a teleporter yourself to spin the object? Or reslly, can players just not be so stupid as to not throw needed ojects where they cannot reach? Designer prevention seems a better way just so it doesn't limit future designers when you might want to do certain things

[Chaos Awakes]

Surely a dungeon is supposed to be designed so that it's impossible for the player to screw up. I don't remember in DM being able to throw something or put something somewhere where it was impossible to get it back, or was I just lucky?

[beowuuf]

Sure, but I feel it is up to the designer to do that rather than limit the engine. And also, it seems a player should not to illogical things that mess up his game then complain!

It will be, for example, possible to put a key down at the feet of an unmoving powerful creatre/NPC and not get it back but I don't want to limit the monster feet pick up mechanics, I'll just make it floating, or if I don't want it floating then it's up to the player to not do this.

[Lunever]

Easy: Just let the editor produce a warning if you position 3 walls around a table.

[Sophia]

Yes, but the key word there is "is designed." It's up to the dungeon designer, not the engine, to ensure these things. DM was carefully designed in order to minimize situations like this. You should do the same in your dungeon.

Surely a dungeon is supposed to be designed so that it's impossible for the player to screw up. I don't remember in DM being able to throw something or put something somewhere where it was impossible to get it back, or was I just lucky?

[George Gilbert]

I'm very much with Gambit and Beowuuf on this one. It's the job of the dungeon designer to ensure that the player can't get into an impossible position, not the job of the engine to police it (let alone enforce it).

Equally, I don't think this is something the compiler can really do.

- Firstly because it's really hard to detect an impossible arrangement (let's say the table is surrounded by 3 removable walls each of which are triggered by various pads; you'd have a terrible job working out whether or not the player must trigger one before reaching the table - and so its safe - or it's possible to bypass the pads and reach the table another route - and so its not).

- Secondly it's not just tables that can produce impossible positions. How about pits with no means to get up, or teleporters that lead to dead areas, or switches that close movable walls behind you and terminally block your path or...or...or...or...you get the idea!

All in all, that sort of thing is far far easier for a human to do than a computer.

To be more helpful though, going back to the very original question - "Can we have some sort of system whereby items thrown at a table only land on the nearside" - then the answer is that there already is something that can do that - as suggested by beowuuf; just use a teleporter on the same tile :-)