New DirectX9 DM clone - entombed

[cowsmanaut]

new walls sent, lion fountain will be to you when you wake up, since you're probably soon to bed, and I'm soon to the store for hours to buy groceries and supplies etc.. I'll finish it all up when I get back. but at least you have somthing new to try a screen shot with both in engine would be nice though

[zoom]

quick reply:
dse, could you also make wireframe screenshots?

[DSE]

I can. May I ask why ?

[Jan]

May I ask why ?

No, you can't!

(I just wrote this to reach my 100th post, so ignore it )

[zoom]

If it is not too much trouble I would just like to see the comparison
wireframe vs ingame screenshot.. (maybe others?)
how your walls are built and what you then add to achieve the looks the game has.

[zoom]

Another nice thing, actually found in DM, would be the form-able or modifyable environment.

In DM you could destroy doors.
Entombed should probably enhance or try allow for these features>

scorch signs where fireballs hit walls. (how is darkness being handled? Do fireballs illuminate Darkness? What about Darkness Spells Des ir Sar, can Fireballs breach it?)

show signs of use or damage on walls if you hit them in succession, depending on weapon used..

---> so the dungeon forms and changes when you "use" it

I then personally always forget all about sound.

What would a fireball be without the searing crackling sound as it passes by,
the sword without the tsching when it is drawn out of its sheathe( this is when a click on weapon icon shows attackoptions)
lightningbolts, footsteps etc...

[zoom]

If it is state of the art it should probably show Zeitgeist
modern haircuts of the champions
animated Health / Stamina / Mana bars.. not just a single pixelline, but a wave that resembles a water surface.
Health could be a bar filled with coloured "health-water"
I am just imagining how items >flasks with the physics animation(previous posts) would shake the fluid inside around, would really be a nice effect.

I know DSE, you are alone, but I told you these ideas nevertheless...
However there is not only form but also function.... one follows the other or so.

The interaktion in a game is crucial (what keys you use or what input device for what..) probably there is some room for tweaking entombed?

[cowsmanaut]

the walls are flat, the depth of the stone work is an illusion performed by displacement and normal mapping. so seeing the wireframe would tell you nothing except that the walls are very low resolution and very very flat.

[zoom]

oh. so no destroying of walls, huh? thanks cows.

all the things I am suggesting are not that easy to get to work...
another feature >
collect multiple items into a pouch and sort it out later in which character inv the items go.
In inventory maybe there could be features like in a texteditor, select with ctrl /shift etc. to quickly move multiple items around

[DSE]

the walls are flat, the depth of the stone work is an illusion performed by displacement and normal mapping. so seeing the wireframe would tell you nothing except that the walls are very low resolution and very very flat.

And look fooking awesome IMO of course. Yes the walls have no vertices really to speak of. Most modern games use parrallx maps (oblivion had really nice ones) now so the gfx cards dont have to transform lots of vertices. This coupled with deferred lighting results in very good frame rates (I have had scenes in my game with 1400 lights moving around, they arent shadow casting but the effect was impressive with 60fps on my comp). FYI - The effect of the brick sticking out is created by the pixel shader.

Zoom - your ideas are really good but, and Im not being an arrogant tw@t here, I have most of them on my list and have been in other games (except the hair idea, what are you smoking ). Most are cosmetic 'nice to haves', not must haves. Yes fire balls light up the walls, yes you will be able to destroy doors and the planks will drop off and physics will be applied. Deformable walls can be done, you can start with a wall that is a simple model. If the party start to 'attack' it the bricks could start to fall out and so on. Not sure if it would just look cool or I would actually use it in game. Maybe I will have squares that are part of the story where 'your way is blocked' kind of thing.

I really want to do caves next. So the place is full of stalagtites and stalagmites with the light reflecting off. I wish to god I had kept my art studies up

[zoom]

DSE no problem. It does no good launching all these observances or mind constructs into thin air.
( btw, I quit smoking couple of years ago.. )
I guess a good thing for me would be to "wait" for the demo and then see what can be enhanced. Something like that.

What monsters could roam in a cave is also no good, too since you have no 3d artists for monsters!

[Moonhawk]

Hey DSE - are you a member of any of the 3d modelling forums that are around (Scifi meshes etc). If you need artists for building and rigging monsters - they might be a good place to drum up help.

I could have a go at modelling some creatures - although I havent done a lot of character modelling.

Do you have any creatures in mind that you would like?
What sort of poly count?
Do they need to be rigged (i.e. bones?)

[cowsmanaut]

I can tell you what I had planned once I got done a few more dungeon bits. I expected to create low poly to the range of 2000 triangles or less. Rigged an Animated with the basic needs, Idle, Attack, walk, die. The mesh is then exported as a .X format. He's currently using 3DSMax for his mesh. I'm using Maya. As for monsters I was intending to do revisited DM monsters.. meaning slightly updated designs of them. Something that captured the creepy mood I felt when I first saw them that no longer happens because.. well.. they are dated

[DSE]

Hey moonhawk :O) Cows is right. My current creature is around 8000 polys in high and 2000 in low detail.

I would love anything to be honest, spiders or scorpions would be great !!! If you are serious then I can post up a list of the required anims.

[DSE]

sorry forgot to say, no im not a member of those sites. I will take a look, would be cool if it was someone on here though. I fellow fan :O)

[cowsmanaut]

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v291/ ... nwater.flv
update vid

[zoom]

Hi cows, the fountain looks good! Entombed needs more of that stuff !

Nevertheless I compared the fountain with the original
found slight differences;


I don´t want to sound arrogant here, just my 2 pence for possible improving :

For me the fountain would have its focus on the basin(water), not on the head(lion)
if the fountain was attached lower and the basin was 1.5 or twice the width size (broader, not higher)

The water which flows out of the mouth of the lion is too much for my taste. Then again it could be ok if so much water spurts out of the fountain, but for this the flow of the fluid is too slow. not enough convincing
I would suggest a tickle or increase flow rate
With less water (a tickle) the lower teeth and chin of the lion would show! now it is sad because you don´t see it.

(Cycle of use:? if drink out of fountain, basin will become empty... new water flows into the basin(very fast)
and stops(tickle) when it is refilled.end of cycle )

whatever just wanted to mention this..!

[DSE]

LOL, did you mean 'trickle' or 'tickle'. Also, remember that this is a pre-render done in maya or similar. This isnt 'in game'. I actually really really like it, I dont think we have to make everything exactly as it was in DM. Or do we ?

[DSE]

Cows - I am at work at the moment so havent had a chance to do anything with it. I will let you know.

[zoom]

oh well, yes I meant trickle. :O
hmm. No we do not have to make everything like dm...I am eager to hear what cows thinks about that.
probably best to not let details talk (unneccessary ones ) slow everyone. I fear I have polluted this thread already a bit

[cowsmanaut]

I will be chaning the basin a bit later on, This was only a temp texture for the wall but as for size I'm happy with it as is so far. I'm making things close to DM not exact DM. You may recall some of my previous work at doing monsters in DM as 2D renditions... They were quite different from those in DM. As it will be again. I only seek to capture the essence of the environment. DM didn't have bridges, hanging flags, Manacles *with* skeletons in them, camp fires, lanterns, shafts of godrays coming through cracks in the walls, etc etc. You may notice the view angle and width of the cooridors are already different, statues, ettins, campfires, and barrels already are within the game. Purist is not what we are seeing here

there is nostalgia for the purist, and then there is an update to refresh a concept. Some people hate refreshing ideas.. other people love it. Batman begins, was not as the origins told in the books exactly.. there were a great many liberties taken. However it was an update.. a renewals for the time. That should he exist today, he might have been more like this.

I also think that deception on our part while doing dungeon bits would be rewarding to those of you playing, where you think you know where you are going.. but you don't

[DSE]

oh well, yes I meant trickle. :O
hmm. No we do not have to make everything like dm...I am eager to hear what cows thinks about that.
probably best to not let details talk (unneccessary ones ) slow everyone. I fear I have polluted this thread already a bit

Not polluting ... just made me laugh. So thanks for that

[zoom]

wise words cows!

[cowsmanaut]

oh, and Zoom.. a side note about the water basin.. The focus is water, so I made it move. Automatically forcing you to look at it.. because it's the only thing moving if you saw pouring water (perhaps with sounds too) and your characters were dying of thirst.. what do you suppose you as a player would do

[Bit]

I just love it!

[cowsmanaut]

zo door concepts

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v291/ ... odoor2.flv

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v291/ ... zodoor.flv

trying a few methods to make a zo door type barrier. I was also thinking of electrical charges, or slow flowing lava..

[zoom]

very cool. The first one I like better. I do not think of a door(where is the switch?) but more of a barrier(resembles the ra doors but cooler, more eerie ghost like feel. Also nice particle flow there!

the second one, I think of as an heat wave kind of thing.

Imagination goes through with me, so I was already thinking about having this effect alongside a fireball.
Maybe even when the fireball is gone, it is still imminent ,a slight difference in temperature that shows itself
(much the same like jet vapor lines on the sky that dissolve)
To mind come new spells .firewall/heatwall. just love the sheer possibilities

[Erik Bauer]

Quoting Zoom's toughts here.

[cowsmanaut]

sorry, brain fart.. ra door, not zo door. Been a while since I played the game :S

Anyway so you like the tendrils, not the massive firey wall. Got it.

there is no frame at the moment, I was only testing FX. It's not particles either, just a texture moving across the surface. By warping the UVs on the surface I get more distortion. Making it look more smokey.

[DSE]

zo door concepts

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v291/ ... odoor2.flv

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v291/ ... zodoor.flv

trying a few methods to make a zo door type barrier. I was also thinking of electrical charges, or slow flowing lava..

The bottom one is great, dont really like the top one TBH. Not sure which one everyone else is referring to (filename or posting position).