CSBuild Version 0.797

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:58 pm

I put version 0.797 at

dianneandpaul.net/CSBwin

It is posted with a password to remind you that it
is still risky to use in a production environment.

I fixed a lot of things not mentioned in the following
release notes. Here are the things I have in my
stack of cards to do in the future.
--Allow delete timer entries type 60 and 61.
--Allow false pits anywhere.
--Allow experience multiplier > 15
--Missiles like fireballs show as ??? in righthand text.
--'Find Object' toolbar button.
--Allow reordering text and acutators.
--Allow text on stairs.
--Mouse leaves trail of False Walls.
--Monsters carrying clothes causes "Unknown Name".
If you find errors in version 0.797 not in the above
list then you must let me know.

Release notes for Version 0.797
===================================================
Version 0.797
--Fixed some rather ill-defined errors in Check|Objects.
--Allow repair of Orphaned Potions.
--Do not mark as Clones objects that are referenced by
a single clone.
--Print absolute (rather than relative) location of
'Illegal Monster Generators'.
--Announce 'No Text Errors' if not errors are found.
--Provide a progress bar for long text searches.
--Correct loading of Little-endian DM savegames.
--Allow repair of cloned scrolls.
--Check for teleporter rooms without teleporter records.
--Allow repair of cloned doors.
--Tolerate teleporter rooms without teleporter records.
--Allow repair of cloned clothing.
--Identify Doors in Clone list.
--Allow repair of Orphaned Chests.

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 10:35 am

Great! Thanks a lot for your latest efforts... I'll re-check the save-game I sent you some days ago with the new program and let you know how it works.

Regards, PitD

Post by **Zyx** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 11:43 am

Hmm, in the case you exhaustively listed all the things to do, then yes, there is something missing: I'd like to be able to put "no graphic" for a champion portrait

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 12:28 pm

What for exactly if I may ask? Just for being able to make an empty mirror?

Regards, PitD

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:55 pm

Paul, I retried to fix the errors shown by CSBuild 0.797 within DMAlternate by Beowuuf and it worked nearly perfectly. I got rid of all of them, although some entries (texts and scrolls mainly) were producing text errors and I had to try to repair them in different order a few times until I could get rid of them; before they only shifted positions although the program said "repaired". I don't know if there are dependencies I could not see - maybe you can guess what's happening.

Regards, PitD

Post by **Zyx** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 2:53 pm

What for? Only for ambience. You'll see in the conflux release.

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 4:41 pm

Zyx - Champion Portraits with 'None'. Carded. I must have
forgotton to write it down last time.

PitD - Yes, repairing many of the errors will move the
errors one step further down the chain of objects.
For example: Cell 1 contains object A and cell 2
contains object A. Object A points to object B.

So object A is referenced twice and is a clone. Object
B is referenced only once (by object A). When you
'repair' object A (by copying it to A1) you cause object
B to become a clone because object A still points to
it and now object A1 points to it also.

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 2:17 am

Zyx:

A Portrait with no graphic? I started studying this
and found that I could interpret your request a half-
dozen different ways. So I need answers before I
make any changes. You can respond privately if it
will ruin any surprises. I'd like to point out that you
can already select 'no graphic' and you see a blank
wall.

What do you want to see on the wall before you touch
the wall?

What do you want to happen when you touch the wall?

What do you want to see on the wall after you have
touched it?

If the Portrait works as ordinary portraits do, what picture
do you want to represent the newly added character?

Post by **Zyx** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 2:31 am

Paul, you are very tempting with your questions about what I want...
But right now, I just want a black rectangle instead of the face of a champion. (Of course it would be great to be allowed more than the 24 faces but let's leave this beg for next year

)

What do you want to see on the wall before you touch
the wall?
A black rectangle.

What do you want to happen when you touch the wall?
The same as for a normal portrait.

What do you want to see on the wall after you have
touched it?
Nothing (or an empty mirror if I used a mirror for example). That is, exactly the same as for a normal portrait.

If the Portrait works as ordinary portraits do, what picture
do you want to represent the newly added character?
A black rectangle.

If you take older versions, this is the way it worked when, by accident, you didn't associate any face to a portrait. I just want this bug to become a feature!

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 1:49 pm

Paul, this is tricky then if you have a long list of errors and don't pay close attention while fixing. But it collides with another question I wanted to pose anyway - is it possible to imagine the "De-Cloning" as an automized process in a future release (selecting more or all entries, making one click telling the engine "go ahead until you're done") ? I was imagining sort of a "batch process" with the engine working through several commands in one go instead of one at a time.

Regards, PitD

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 6:25 pm

Automated decloning? Yes, I can imagine it. And
I did imagine it as I decloned what seemed like several
hundred clones....many times while testing. But I don't
want to implement it. These clones are ugly. You should
be aware that they are ugly. If you are going to create
them then you are going to suffer if you want to remove
them. The option is to stop creating the *&#$% things.
Ditto with Orphans.

Post by **Zyx** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 9:14 pm

And it worked very efficiently with me. I have a such nociception with clones now that I feel sick only thinking of them. I just don't want to declone my dungeon again. I try to solve all the mechanisms with other ways.
Except for 2 cases, I managed it.
One is linking a teleporter to an alcove, so you can teleport the objects away from the alcove.
The other is putting ONE object in several possible locations. The first location where you pick it up will cancel all the others (using object holders).

Switching to bug report:
CSBuild797 doesn't allow the alternate mon potion.

Anybody knows a way to show the 3rd graphic of the staff of claws?

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 11:32 pm

1) Teleport objects from alcove.
2) Several objects. Picking up any one removes
the others.

If these are crucial we can design a way. We can
probably already do it with DSA. It can remove
objects and place objects. See the 'Money Changer'.

3) Alternate Mon Potion. I don't know what this is. I
will look into it. I wrote it down and will get back to
you if I cannot figure it out.

Post by **Zyx** » Sat Nov 15, 2003 1:47 am

No, these problems are not crucial and they can probably be solved by DSA as you said.

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Tue Nov 18, 2003 10:12 am

I agree clones are ugly - but if I did not create them and just want to play a game without clones or orphans so as to minimize the risk of CSBwin crashing, what then? There's a lot of save games/dungeons out there that have clones and I did not build a single one of them... but it will be a lot of work with some of them getting them "clean"....

Regards, PitD

Post by **Paul Stevens** » Tue Nov 18, 2003 3:00 pm

In some cases it will take a LOT of study to clean up these
games. Will it not? I know at least some authors used clones
to achieve a particular purpose. You cannot blindly removee them.
You need to know why they are there and arrange to accomplish
the same thing legally.

If you are not up to the task, I would be happy to 'de-clone'
your dungeons by simply copying all the clones. It only takes
a few minutes. Then you could playtest and fix any problems
that result. In fact, I would like to do this because it would
provide such a wide range of additional testing.

PicturesInTheDark · Post by **PicturesInTheDark** » Tue Nov 18, 2003 3:52 pm

I was just asking for your reasons. After de-cloning DM Alternate I think I can safely say I am able to do it, the question was just with more or less effort.

Regards, PitD