overhead DM

Post by **cowsmanaut** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:45 am

yes, it's a real screenshot from a real engine.. and we have working doors, monsters attacking.. dying, dropping screamer slices, picking up and dropping stuff, teleporters, pads, and a few other things.

It's a gradual work in progress.. we are thinking the good test will be choose your fate. So, we'll have a playable level so people can see how it works.

Now, what is cool about this beyond the top view, is that it will be possible to play cooperatively and online. So for those of you far away from me, I can join a server and chat and play DM with you..

we'll see how it works out.. this engine was not orriginally intended for this, but it's a starting test to see how it all works..

I'm sure we'll have some comments.. haha

moo

ian_scho · Post by **ian_scho** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:07 am

Nooo waaaaay. Nice one Cows.
Seeing those little screamers just brings a warm feeling to my heart. Chopping them up will bring a full feeling to my stomache.

I wreckon it will feel like one of those old SSI (Stratetic Simulations Inc) games, yet be in it's own mould. Keep up the good work, and I want to see how/why you implement Magic Footpruints!!!

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:14 am

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH

OK, I'm done

So, what are all the actions? You have pick up, examine and attack? Or are they simply the eight slots for four sets of hands or a full party?

How many poeple do you control, and is the visible eight slots all you can carry? How do you intend to handle things like lighting for multiplayer, and will there be spells if it's actually a different engine? And how will food/etc work?

Tell us more! *bounce*

Trantor · Post by **Trantor** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:59 am

Oh wow, this looks freaking cool! And I'm with Beo here - we need more info!

ian_scho · Post by **ian_scho** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:59 pm

More info, more info!

The one thing missing with those SSI games was an editor. Looking at how we're spoilt for choices for an engine/editor with DM now, THAT would of course make it the 'bees knees'.

Post by **Ameena** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:24 pm

Woooooooooooooooooooooo, coooooooool

. Yaeh and I agree with Wuffy and Trant and Ian - more info pleeeeeaasse! Multi-player DM...fantastic!

Post by **Gambit37** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 5:45 pm

That looks frickin' awesome! I always wondered what an isometric version of DM would be like, so this is pretty close! Lovely! *claps*

Post by **cowsmanaut** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:27 pm

Well, as said. Currently we just have the basics done. You control one of the heros. We are currently thinking about interface options. What you see along the bottom are action icons to the left, and storage icons to the right. The plan is to have a proper back pack and one has already been designed based on the orriginal. also thinking about the changes of some of the puzzles to account for the angle of view. Ie the Matrix. Which incidentally would be a good place to use the magic footprints.. perhaps there might be others.. The one spell that might be useless until we limit view from inside rooms is the hole in wall spell

Anyway, No real animation has been done yet, but everything moves. The monster do their standard DM attack and you hear them walk and screech. You see doors go up and down with the kachunk kachunk kachunk. And movement is based on tile to tile but it's been smoothed out a bit. Operational teleporters are ready to go . We are working on altar VI now to bring on the wonders of resserection.

The client to the game is also the editor (if you are granted edit permission), so you can create new objects, build onto existing ones, create/modify/delete scripts, change the game graphics, all while you and others are playing the game.

So in terms of editing it offers something no one has really done before and it's options at the moment seem almost limitless. What you don't see in this screen shot is the chat window which shows up much like a MSN window showing what people have said as well as information about what you've done... and allows for the input of scripts. there is a hot key to go to the tile editor which allows you to upload or replace tiles (again while the game is in action) as well as pick tiles you wish to place.

anyway, I can keep talking about it, but I suppose it would be better for specific questions. I'm going to share one thought though... ZYX given edit controls as you play... may god have mercy on your soul

Post by **Sophia** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:33 pm

Interesting.

It reminds of a cross between DM and Gauntlet.

What scripting language are you using?

Post by **cowsmanaut** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:45 pm

the scripting language looks like a strongly typed JavaScript

Code: Select all

entrypoint void Teleport(int collider, int collidee, int fStepOn)
{
   if(!fStepOn) // Stepping off of a teleporter does nothing, so return
      return;

   int target=Object_GetPropertyInt(collider, "Destination");
   Object_Teleport(collidee, Object_GetX(target)+1, Object_GetY(target), Object_GetZ(target));

   PlaySound(Object_GetX(collidee), Object_GetY(collidee), Object_GetZ(collidee), 5);
}

Sample of the teleport script.

Also the scripting engine runs scripts in parallel.
So you can have one script opening a door and another one of someone attacking both running at once.

Post by **Sophia** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:10 pm

cowsmanaut wrote:Also the scripting engine runs scripts in parallel.

Wow, that is pretty neat, though it of course makes the scripting inherently more difficult-- everything has to be re-entrant and behave as if it were in a multithreaded environment-- throw in network latency issues, and I don't envy you one bit.

For example, suppose something happened that destroyed the "collider" or the "collidee" betwen the time the teleport function was invoked and when those variables were needed...

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:19 pm

In terms of scripting being made difficult it's yes and no. Many people like writing scripts like this:

DoAction1();
Sleep(1000);
DoAction2();
Sleep(1000);
DoAction3();

Which only work properly if you can run multiple scripts in parallel, since otherwise the game hangs on every sleep call.

The game's roots are from a mud/muck style system where users could write their own scripts and they had to run in parallel to prevent one user from doing a while(1) { } loop. If only trusted users could write scripts they could all be made synchronous and use timers.

It's still an experiment to see what it can do and how easily. I have other ideas to try based on what we use in it.

And your example of deleting an object being worked on, well if you did that the script will just abort with an invalid object. It's your own bug if you pull the rug out from under yourself

Post by **Sophia** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:42 pm

Ryan wrote:Many people like writing scripts like this

You're right that it can make the scripts simpler, because people don't have to worry about using timers or anything, anymore, they can just write the code as though it had its own thread to run in-- but that also requires that the users have some idea of "thread-safe" scripting, which is also not the easiest concept for novices to grasp.

It seems a bit of a balancing act and I wish you luck in it, it sounds neat.

Ryan wrote:It's your own bug if you pull the rug out from under yourself

In a multi-user environment with multiple scripts running at any given time, someone else could just as easily have pulled the rug out from under me.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:10 pm

You bring up an excellent point though. I could always have a mode where every script is running synchronously until it sleeps, if the thread-safe scripting winds up being a boondoggle.

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:13 pm

Hello Ryan - now the mystery of the 'beip master' rank is revealed!

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:01 pm

The hole in the wall spell could actually create a hole in the wall, enough for the party to shoot spells and thrown items through

Post by **cowsmanaut** » Sun Feb 04, 2007 1:34 am

Altar of rebirth was done, had to make it a platform due to the angle of view, but it's a platrofm in DM2 so it's not anti DM I guess. It was funny.. we were resurrecting ham

which then turned into a hero.. which ofcourse did not move.. because it was ham

but worked wonderfully for real hero's who died

"Damn it Halk!! I said go resurrect STAMM not HAM!! I swear.. sometimes I just don't know about you!"

fun fun

Tom Hatfield · Post by **Tom Hatfield** » Sun Feb 04, 2007 2:39 am

BWA HWA HWA!!!! Resurrecting ham. That provides for some interesting dungeon mechanisms.

Post by **Lunever** » Sun Feb 04, 2007 9:32 am

Woooohooo! Mulitplayer DM!! And I love those rare RPG with an Ultima or SSI or Gauntlet -like perspective!
Maybe well soon meet each other there online!

beowuuf · Post by **beowuuf** » Sun Feb 04, 2007 10:41 am

And toast each other with fireballs - bonus!

Trantor · Post by **Trantor** » Sun Feb 04, 2007 12:50 pm

Here's an idea for the "hole in wall" spell. Leave every place the character cannot see directly black, similar to the "fog of war" of Warcraft and Starcraft. If you cast OH EW RA (or whatever it will be), you can see the other room behind the wall.

Sabreman · Post by **Sabreman** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:37 am

This looks great, and completely unexpected. Aside from DM and World of Warcraft my other gaming obsession is Roguelikes, so I'm immediately drawn to any kind of top-down RPG.

|Really looking forward to seeing this develop

ian_scho · Post by **ian_scho** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:14 am

Nooo waaaay '''Rogue''' THAT was the name of the game I've been searching for in my head for ages. What a superb game. A tough one to beat, that.

Post by **cowsmanaut** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:25 am

I'd say we are at least a wee bit different than that

new image, just showing some new items done..

We have fireball launchers added, the mummy is our first 4 way moving monster so it can move and turn and attack and all that.. before we had the screamer which of course has only two images. Rock pile is mostly done now too. Making some changes to how doors work and made fireball turners.. not shown here.. but a new blue haze was made for that. hmm what else was done today.. Ryan made several bug fixes.. always important.

several new decorations made as well..

ian_scho · Post by **ian_scho** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:33 am

I love the fountain... Good to see it used elsewhere than DMJava.
Seeing the VI altar look like that gives me a smile. It should only have a 'half' depth, though? Maybe you can approach it from both sides in this engine, eh?
The pit appears to be 4 squares, rather than 4 small single squares, which is good!
Yep, keep up the good work. Looking forward to poking around in this one.

copperman · Post by **copperman** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:36 am

This all looks rather funky Cows et al. It reminds me of the Amiga release Shadowlands. I look forward to playing this.

Post by **Ameena** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:21 pm

Out of curiosity, are grouped monsters restricted to remaining in their groups, as in original DM (well, Atari at least, dunno about other versions), or are they permitted to wander away from each other, as in RTC?

Post by **Gambit37** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:40 pm

Looking again, I see that you're using "sub-tiles" -- ie, what was previously a large cell in DM containing four monsters or four party members are now split into four. So this means you only ever play a single character and monsters can only attack singly if in a single tile narrow corridor?

Post by **Lunever** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:40 pm

I just try to remember what's been the first overhead perspective RPG I've played, which would also be the first RPG I ever played. I think it was Legend of Fargoal on C64. Does anyone know that one?

ian_scho · Post by **ian_scho** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:54 pm

Another Noooo Waaaay.
If it's been released on the PC (I had an 086 chip, wow), Legend of Fargoal was the other name I couldnt put my finger on. Played it for a while, that one.... But strangely cant find it on the net. Must have had a similar sounding name, and it was aaages ago.